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Originally written by Emperor Tullegolar:

Thuryl: Your are becoming confused, though that is to be expected from such a long thread. I explained Horrigan's crimes to show that he was the game's primary antagonist, because someone said Fallout 2 didn’t have one. I never said he was any good at filling that roll, in fact, he really is a crappy final boss.

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Avernum games must end with a violent confrontation.

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Originally written by Drakefyre:

Would you buy a computer game where the character was already defined for you and sometimes spoke and acted in ways that you would never do?

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Originally written by Emperor Tullegolar:

I must disagree on the point of Fallout 2.

(snip laundry list of war crimes)

Maybe you missed out on some of these events, but I believe Horrigan is meant to be the main antagonist never-the-less. He doesn’t, however, hold a candle to The Master, who is probably the greatest video game villain of all time.

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As for the games Ash Lael mentioned, I've not played a single one, interestingly enough, are they available for mac?

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Kelandon: When I ask a question like the one you answered I am expecting an answer that is relevant to the topic of Avernum games. Take your myst villains, for example. Yes, those were all very intriguing characters, great villains, to be sure. But could you fight against them with swords and spells? I would like to keep it within the Avernum genre. I’ll rephrase the question: what is the ideal violent fantasy role playing game villain?

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Originally written by Emperor Tullegolar:

What good game doesn’t have a lead antagonist?

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Originally written by Emperor Tullegolar:

I would like to see a reputation system similar to that of Fallout. Even though the game had a single plot and a single enemy that you fought in the end, it let you choose to follow a good or evil path up until that point. If you were good, you helped the common people and they helped you against the final enemies. If you were evil, you attacked the common people alongside the bandits and whatnot, and using the strength thus gained you went up against the final enemies.

It wasn’t really faction oriented, and each town you visited was like a new beginning, unless you were renown as particularly good or evil. Are there any Blades scenarios that take this approach?

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Originally written by Emperor Tullegolar:

You both seem to think that there should have been more interaction with the Vahnatai in general and Rentar in particular. I am not so sure about this. The Vahnatai are notorious for being uncomfortable around humans. I think Jeff always intended for them to be alien in out eyes. That is why we never really get to know them or even really understand their motives.

In fact, could it be that this burning curiosity we were left with regarding Rentar and the Vahnatai's motives was intentional?

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Kelandon: Perhaps I was making stuff up. Is that not the point? Do you even know what RPG stands for? If you really need a game where everything is spelled out for you, play something else.

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Originally written by Drakefyre:

EDIT: I prefer Exile II, where the generally accepted strategy was just to mindduel him out of SP.

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Originally written by Kelandon:

Let me do my best to attempt to hold you to it, lest you've forgotten your promise.

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Originally written by Drakefyre:

But Avernum 4 doesn't really do it for me with Rentar. I would have loved to see it go purely down the Darkside Loyalist road. There is a secret group of people in Avernum who want to take it down and you, as a member of Unspecified Services, need to find these people, discover their plots, foil them, and then destroy them. That would have been an awesome game!

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Originally written by Emperor Tullegolar:

Are you saying the plot should not be driven by the players? If you want to simply observe the story rather than drive it, perhaps you would be more suited to reading books than playing games.

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Originally written by Nioca:

If you inflict acid or poison damage with the damage_char call, it bypasses the corresponding resistances. In other words, if you hit a creature with 100 acid damage with the above call, the creature will take 100 damage regardless of the creatures acid resistance.

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Also, there is a glitch with the call dist_to_char. If you use a variable for which_char, the whole script breaks down.

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Originally written by shadow9d9:

Doesn't it make more sense to go all into intelligence than the shaping skills? That way you could max out new creations' strength, etc? It seems like you get the new creations from exploring, and not levelling. Wouldn't it be better to max strength than to give the creation a few levels?

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And also, does strength affect everyones' damage, including missile type creations?

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Originally written by Lenar, Inc.:

that was odd. I got the FYI flooding message without doing anything, and then, with my only refreshing the page, the UBB posted a copy.

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Originally written by I'll Steal Your Toast:

Descartes was wrong about splitting the world into rational/irrational so new models have to be developed based on decision making. Descartes essentially disproves himself in many situations. This is pretty controversial stuff.

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Originally written by Randomizer:

You have to determine whether the new creation will have higher stats than one that has been around from earlier in the game. Usually if you have raised your shaping level, gotten certain items, and/or more levels with that creation the new creature will be more powerful for the same essence cost.

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Originally written by Not a Republic:

—Alorael, who is now no longer entirely sure that the original Exile had only one action per turn.

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