Profile for Suspicious Vlish

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Displayed name	Suspicious Vlish
Member number	2245
Title	Infiltrator
Postcount	522
Homepage	http://N/A
Registered	Friday, November 15 2002 08:00

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Unbound a little small? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Sunday, March 18 2007 03:30 Profile Homepage #0 I replayed the Rebel ending, and I noticed that the Unbound a little... smaller than I expected (no joke). Check out the picture with the lizard creature holding the human over its head. It looks way too small to be either Unbound or Drakon. I find it hard to believe that those creatures are terrorizing Terrestia. They are drawn well, but perhaps they should have been bigger! -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
If you could be any creation... in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Sunday, March 18 2007 02:59 Profile Homepage #19 enzo: quote: "Ah, the Eye sees all. Do not fear the Eye, just look into it...no not that one Idiot, this one! LOL! -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Wingbolts are over-rated in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Sunday, March 18 2007 02:57 Profile Homepage #6 Thuryl: I used a Shock Trooper. I could have made a second wingbolt, but it wouldn't have had the 2 intel. required for control. -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Wingbolts are over-rated in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Sunday, March 18 2007 02:10 Profile Homepage #4 Thuryl: quote: I really don't get why people keep saying Wingbolts are fragile. They only have a little less HP than rotghroths, Wow. I never made a rotgroth, but if the above is true, then it must be a pretty crappy battle creation. I had about 5 in magic shaping, and my Wingbolts possessed approx 350 hp's. quote: and their very high magic resistance is a major asset. Yeah... I don't deny that. Too bad a little drayk fireball rips them a new hole. quote: Even their resistance to physical damage is actually pretty good. It's OK. quote: Drayks are good too, of course, but if fragility is your main concern about Wingbolts, well, Drayks die even easier. I agree. My Drayks had 50 less hp's than my wingbolt. The difference is that my Drayk didn't cost a whopping 135 essence. Two Drayks have far more hitpoints that one Wingbolt, and do just as much damage combined (and far more, if they are both hasted and blessed.) I can't place my finger on it, but I find that Wingbolts tend to be pretty sucky in a 'real' fight. Frail for their cost, and they ALWAYS run away when they take a hit or two. -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
National anthem for the rebels in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Sunday, March 18 2007 01:56 Profile Homepage #0 Why do the Rebels not have some sort of national or patriotic song? Every revolutionary movement has some sort of song to lift the spirit of the troops! It might also help bring a bit of unity amongst the varying races in the Rebellion. Personally, I think that an adapted 'Geneforge' version of the La Marseillaise (French national anthem) or Dabrowski Mazurka (Polish national anthem) are appropriate. What do you other chaps thing? And what sort of anthem would fit the Shapers? For some reason, I think that the Soviet anthem would be appropriate... and possibly 'Rule Britannia'. [ Sunday, March 18, 2007 01:57: Message edited by: Waylander ] -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
What people would you like to be? [fixed] in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Sunday, March 18 2007 01:48 Profile Homepage #7 VIVA LA REBELLION! -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Wingbolts are over-rated in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Saturday, March 17 2007 23:18 Profile Homepage #0 Is it just me, or do many veterans seem to be praising Wingbolts, when they really don't deserve it? Sure, the Wingbolts do fantastic magic damage to a single target. But they are ridiculously fragile, and always seem to flee combat after losing less than half their health. That really frustrates me! I find two Drayks far more effective than a single Wingbolt. For example, I struggled to take Monarch down with a single Wingbolt and a Drayk, so I replaced it with two Drayks. Monarch became a breeze. -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Time Magazine: Shaper of the Year in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Saturday, March 17 2007 23:14 Profile Homepage #9 Also, the poll neglects to mention the Shaper who created Drayks. Drayks are by far the 'best' creation in the game, when considering strength vs. cost. -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Time Magazine: Shaper of the Year in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Saturday, March 17 2007 23:13 Profile Homepage #8 Mica, I know that Tulduric discovered how to alter serviles. But I also thought that the Drakons made a similiar discovery independent of Tulduric and the Awakened (eg. Eass has the ability to Shape you without any required machinery). Or was that only after you stole the Awakaned Research for the Takers? I'm not sure. -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Time Magazine: Shaper of the Year in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Saturday, March 17 2007 20:09 Profile Homepage #6 The Drakon who managed to modify serviles in such a way so that they could cast powerful magic spells (I think it was Easss...) -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Oh, so the Shapers are more ethical, are they now? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Saturday, March 17 2007 19:34 Profile Homepage #0 It's laughable that some posters contend that the Shapers are more ethical than the Drakons, because they refuse to release uncontrollable, powerful rogues, which tend to kill indiscriminately. But what do we see in the Rebel ending? The Shapers doing exactly that! So this pretty much amounts to: - When the Shapers are winning a war and pretty much ripping the Rebellion to shreds, they condemn the Drakons 'dirty tactics'. - However, when the Shapers are getting an ass whipping, they turn around and use the exact same tactics. Which just proves that the Shapers do NOT have the moral highground. When they are in the exact same position that the Rebels have experienced since GF 2 (ergo. They are the defensive underdogs), they act in exactly the same way. "What, we lack the numbers to fight the enemy. No probs, just throw up a couple of spawners, and make rogue, powerful creations!" Hypocrites. At least the Drakons are honest about who they are, what they are doing, and what they are fighting for. -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Saturday, March 17 2007 19:20 Profile Homepage #89 Emp, I don't have the time for an indepth reply at the moment, but I'm 100% sure that the Gazers were first created by the Drakons. Barzhal thought of the design, but the Drakons brought it into being. I remember an eyebeast in GF 2 mentioning this (perhaps the Eyebeast in Radiant College, or the one who judges you prior to entering Rising). Can any other posters here find the quote I'm referring to? I know that it exists, because I remember having it thrust in my face several years ago when I was arguing for Barzite superiority. [ Saturday, March 17, 2007 19:22: Message edited by: Waylander ] -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Saturday, March 17 2007 18:38 Profile Homepage #85 By the way, I wonder if the posters here who condemn the Drakons for unleashing the Unbound support America's nuclear bombing of Japan, or the indiscriminate napalming of the Vietnamese forests? What about the indiscriminate bombing of German cities during WWII? What about Israel's devastation of Lebanon? I know that quite a few posters here are Zionists, and use the "Well, Israel is under constant attack from enemies who want to destroy her, and annihilate the Jewish people!" as justification for excessive force against the neighbouring Arabs. Hmmm, when your very right to exist is in question, it seems that acts of gross and excessive violence are quite OK. You'd have to be an idiot to promote limited warfare when not just your very way of life, but the survival of your species, is on the line. Quite simply, I take great delight in releasing the Unbound for the Drakons, to rip the Shapers and their weak allies from the face of the earth. The decadent Shapers and their miserable allies get exactly what has been coming to them all along... decimation. How dare they deny such mighty and glorious creations such as the Drayk, Eyebeast and Drakon the very right to exist! Because they are... too potentially dangerous... That's absurd. Would you round up and genocide all of the mutants in the 'X-Men' world because their powers made them potentially dangerous? How is such a solution any more ethical than the Drakons releasing the Unbound on the Shapers and their sympathizers? And by what right do the Shapers demand the genocide of a species? Was their a plebiscite to determine whether humans should parley with Drakons? Are the Shapers the democratically elected representatives of the humans and the creations? No, they aren't. They are essentially an aristocracy who maintains power by monopolizing Shaper knowledge. Why should only their opinions matter when it comes to Shaping? Does only a doctor's opinion matter when it comes to political decisions about the status of Healthcare? Does only a scientist's opinion matter when it comes to political decisions about scientific issues (global warming?). Quite the contrary! In fact, scientific and medical bodies are often regulated by people separate from the field. I don't see that in Geneforge. What I see is the Shapers monopolizing a mighty craft, when they have no right to do so. Just a thought for the people who condemn the Drakons as 'war mongers'. I disagree. As the (now adapted) old saying goes: "The Drakons make establishing peace difficult, but the Shapers make it impossible." Had the Shapers merely allowed the Drayks and Drakons the right to exist, and the serviles the right to autonomy, then there would be no need for warfare. However, as the matter stands, the Drakons/Drayks need to fight for survival, and now that the serviles realize that they can function as autonomous beings, they can no longer remain in servitude. They must throw off their chains. Quite simply, their hand is forced. The only other options (apart from releasing the Unbound) for the Drakons and Drayks is to (literally) commit suicide, or refuse to release the Unbound and commit metaphorical suicide as the Shapers continue their genocide. Remember, the construction and releasing of the Unbound is ESSENTIAL for the survival of the Rebellion, and hence the Drakon and Drayk species. The Drakons know this, and every ending in which the Unbound are not released involves the smashing of the resistance, and the genocide of the Drayks, Drakons, and free creations. If you were a Drakon, a Drayk, or a free creation, would you accept such a fate? I see releasing the Unbound as a matter of self-defense. If I were a Jew under Nazi oppression, I would use any means necessary to preserve my life, and the brilliance of my race. As for the Drakons demonstrating a 'lack of empathy'. No, I don't agree that Drakons (as a race in general) lack empathy towards the lesser races. Yes, they view them as inferior, but that doesn't mean that they are incapable of experiencing empathy for the lesser races. A human views a dog as an inferior species, but that doesn't necessarily mean that they can't experience empathy for the dog in question. Ghaldring, despite viewing lesser species as inferior, mentions that he wants to protect the lesser races in the mountains. As for arrogance. Yes, Drakons are arrogant. What of it? They are the spearhead of the Rebellion. Most of the Rebellion's victories are attributable to them. They created and can control the most powerful Creations in existence (the Unbound). They are primarily responsible for making Shaping available to the Rebels. Modified serviles and humans wouldn't exist if the Drakons hadn't leaked the knowledge to them. The Drakons are arrogant towards lesser species, but unlike the Shapers, they have yet to advocate their genocide. I hear no talk of the Drakons wishing to eliminate Drayks, Eyebeasts, Geneforged humans, or free thinking serviles, merely for existing. Quite the contrary. Even the human/servile hating Drakon Salassar merely wants to break ties with the human half of the Rebellion. He doesn't want to eliminate them. If I were a Drayk, an Eyebeast, a servile, or a Geneforged human, I'd take Drakon arrogance over Shaper genocide any day. I'd rather tolerate a bad attitude than non-existence. What really aggravates me is how the humans and creations condemn the Drakons for releasing the Unbound. It is precisely because of the Drakons and Unbound that the Rebels are able to avoid liquidation by the Shapers, and remain in the mountains, where they are not slaughtered in the front lines. Because of the Drakons, Unbound are in the front lines, not sapient beings such as serviles and humans. And what thanks do the Drakons get? NONE. Yes, it's very easy to condemn the Drakons decision when the threat of complete elimination and torture aren't hanging over your head, and you're snug and cozy, far away from the front lines. I'm sure that if the Shapers were storming the gates of Quess-Esss, the Rebels would be begging for the Unbound to be completed and released. Sorry for the long post. It wasn't intended to be so lengthy, but I think I got a little carried away. - [ Saturday, March 17, 2007 19:17: Message edited by: Waylander ] -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Saturday, March 17 2007 18:34 Profile Homepage #84 Yes, we are superior beings. But that doesn't necessarily mean we need to exclude the lesser races. What they do need to realize is that WE are at the top of the pecking order... -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Saturday, March 17 2007 16:45 Profile Homepage #80 quote: Well, if I have to repeat myself, again, I was talking about the entrance to the Radient College, which is described as being overly eleborate. Barzahl, from the moment he arrived in Drypeak, was preparing for his inevitible war with the Shapers. While preparing, he still made time for art. I'm hesitate to qualify that as artwork. If 'elaborate' buildings used for practical purposes qualify as artwork, may I point out that the Drakon Council room in GF4 was described as 'luxurious'? Also note that Drakons have a tendency to wear jewelery. This strongly suggests that they are aesthetic beings. quote: [A Drakon's behaviourism, IQ and EQ apparently resembles that of a human: No they don't, not at all. What makes you say that? The question here is: What Drakon behaviourisms differ from lesser beings? Drakons, like humans, communicate and function socially in a manner similiar to humans. Drakons, like humans, have a complex political structure, including the cloak and dagger scheming. Drakons, like humans, are capable of arrogance, fear, love (suggested by the fact that they do breed naturally, instead of always Shaping new Drakons) and empathy. quote: No they don't. Drayks and serviles constantly complain that the drakons care little for either race. Then why would Ghaldring mention that he would use the Unbound to shelter the Rebel creations/humans in the mountains? If he had no empathy for the lesser races, why would he make such an irrelevant comment? quote: Again, no. Usually, when anything is improved by shaping, emotion is the first thing to go. It's been demonstrated time and time again that individuals who are Shaped are still capable of empathy (Lilita, Trajkov). Ghaldring (and his fellow drakons) also show empathy and respect towards his fallen rival. quote: Will your inaccuracies ever stop? How were canisters improved? They were the same damn things. Aura of Flames canisters were not present in GF1... quote: As for the geneforge, the original human geneforge made you character (or Trajkov or Goettsch) into a demi-god, Not really. It increased all of your stats by 7. [quote the drakon geneforges merely make them into ur-drakons. [/quote] Ur-Drakons are significantly superior to Drakons. After using the Geneforge, Easss and Akhari Blaze are exceedingly powerful. quote: However, when humans abandon the need to control creations, like Shaper Monarch did, they make the most powerful creations ever seen: the Titan. I didn't find the Titan that difficult, when compared to some of the creations in the Taker/Rebel dumping grounds. May I also point out the Unbound. Not only can the Drakons create such magnificent beings, they also have some measure of control over them. In fact, Drakons are the only creations capable of controlling and directing the Unbound. quote: quote: Originally written by Waylander: Barzhal conceived the idea of the eyebeast, but he wasn't the first to create one. Does it say this somewhere? Yep, in the Radiant College. [ Saturday, March 17, 2007 18:32: Message edited by: Waylander ] -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Friday, March 16 2007 23:13 Profile Homepage #69 Stillness: quote: Although it would seem that Drakons are physically stronger, they seem to lack the agility of humans. I'm not sure what you mean by this. I agree that Drakon claws are far clumsier than human/servile hands (it's actually mentioned in GF2 that Drayks have clumsy handwriting), but Drakons move as fast as a human, if not faster (they have 8 AP, Quick Action, and always seem to strike me first in battle...) quote: Think about your battles with drakons and people. Are the Drakons really any harder to kill? In general, yes. However, I did find Monarch harder than any Drakon. But I'd attribute that to the fact that Monarch is found far earlier in the game, when your PC is 'greener'. By the end, I had several of my own Drakons to fight the opposing Drakons... While it is possible for humans to match Drakons in strength and speed, they usually have to be Shaped to the Max, or a Master Master Shaper with, with apparently centuries of experience and some nice equipment. Either way, an unexperienced Drakon is far more powerful than an unexperienced human. Analogy: A woman, with adequate training, could easily overpower the average male. However, that doesn't change the fact that men have more innate physical power than women. quote: As far as spells v. Drakon fire, I havent noticed their fire hitting harder than spells. I tend to play on Torment, and have noticed that since GF2, their breath spells rip me a new *****. They seem to be more lethal that the average spell casting human. quote: they capable of battle, mental, or blessing magic? They don't seem capable of magic to the same extent as humans. I remember that several Drayks in the series have the ability to cast spells. In fact, a Drayk in the Rebel Stronghold goes out of his way to teach you. A Cryodrayk (Salassdar?) in GF 2 also teaches you powerful spells (if you are a Taker). As Drakons are merely improved Drayks, it stands to reason that they are capable of spell casting. They just don't bother, since teeth and their fiery breath pretty much do the job. quote: The fact that they have made advances in shaping might be due to the fact that they face the risk of extinction. I'm sure that the risk of extinction, and an upcoming war with the Shapers, were driving factors which catalyzed their Shaping advancement. But that doesn't somehow cheapen their achievements. quote: Also, they don't have the same self-imposed boundaries that the shapers have. True. But they still kick ass. -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00**
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Friday, March 16 2007 20:20 Profile Homepage #67 quote: Yeah, but they're not doing either. As I said in my last post, the drakon high command is more intent on concerning itself with bickering amongst each other rather than fixing the almost defunct rebellion. Well no, that's just hyperbole. While there were a couple of rogue Drakons who rebelled against the hierarchy, in general the Drakons seemed to cooperate as a cohesive whole. They were expending effort into fighting the Shapers (witness the Unbound). quote: He is still building these things when you visit them (during chaos). 'These things'? What exactly do you mean by that? Do roads and buildings which serve a practical purpose qualify as 'art' now? If so, then the Takers and the Rebellion have produced a lot of 'art'. Tell me, do you think that France would have constructed the Statue of Liberty if they had been in the middle of fighting WWI? quote: Who are you to say that this isn't a stretch? How many other sapient species besides humans do you know of? Given that humans are the only known sapient species, it makes perfect sense to use them as a baseline. A Drakon's behaviourism, IQ and EQ apparently resembles that of a human, hence the evidence suggests that they can feel emotion. Another line of evidence is that Drayks clearly demonstrate empathy for other beings. Given that Drakons are merely improved version of Drayks, it stands to reason that they are likely to have the capacity to experience emotion. quote: In the series I played, humans invented the canisters and geneforge. Which were very crude. The Takers, and the Drakons, made vast improvements. quote: They also created the drakons themselves, Again, the Drakons are far more apt at creating Drakons that their human counterparts. quote: rotgroths, The Taker rotgroths were superior to the human (Barzite) rotgroths, as even the Barzite in the Radiant College mentioned. quote: eyebeasts, Barzhal conceived the idea of the eyebeast, but he wasn't the first to create one. It was the Taker Drakons who first created an eyebeast. quote: and... oh... every single other creation in the game. Well, no. There are numerous creations which the Drakons have vastly improved on. I thought you would have come to realize this as you hacked your way through the Taker/Rebel dumping grounds. quote: This is all rebel propaganda. The rebellion can do almost nothing that the shapers didn't do first. A computer hasn't done anything which a human hasn't done first. I guess the fact that a computer performs all of these tasks with far greater calculation power and efficiency doesn't come into the equation... quote: As I said before, humans are responsible for all new creations. You just keep telling yourself that. All those variations which have come out of the Drakon labs and into the dumping grounds don't exist... -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Friday, March 16 2007 17:37 Profile Homepage #56 quote: The serviles that built Northforge, as Diki pointed out, left space for art in the walls. The drakons have had plenty of time to ignore the war and have petty political squabbles while the rebellion crumbles (Southforge), So you're suggesting that since the Drakons don't give artwork priority over fighting a war and maintaining a stable, functional rebellion, they musn't have any appreciation for art? Huh? Although may I point out that the Shaping of creations could be seen as artwork, even though its primary purpose may be for warfare? quote: but they don't seem to have any need or desire to fill those walls with art. Or perhaps they have their priorities straight. Saving their species and the Rebellion first, and hang pretty pictures later. I doubt Hitler had much time for paintings when he engaged on his mission to conquer Europe, despite the fact that he initially desired to be an artist. quote: Barzahl, on the other hand, in the midst of complete chaos in Drypeak, Complete chaos? Huh? For years, Barzhal pretty much had an informal truce with the other three sects. quote: quote: Originally written by Waylander: It's not a huge stretch to conclude that given their remarkable similiarites to humans, they can experience an appreciation for art. So the things I say aren't logically reasonable, but you're fine with this nonsense? How is it nonsense? If, like humans, Drakons possess sentience, sapience and introspection, it isn't a far stretch to deduce that they are capable of emotion. quote: Besides, you're not claiming that their similar, you're claiming that they are superior. It looks like you're grappling with this concept, so allow me to explain. Being 'similiar' to someone in some aspects, and being superior to them in general, are not mutually exclusive. Chimpanzees are similiar to humans in many aspects (tool making, social structure, morphology), but I doubt anyone would deny that human beings are superior. quote: Where is your evidence (or reasoning, I'm fine with either) that they are superior? Hmm, let's see: 1. Drakons have been demonstrated to be better Shapers than the Shapers themselves. Oh, and if you're looking for evidence, try replaying the entire series. 2. Drakons are born physically superior to humans. I'm not talking 'polar bear vs. human', I'm talking more along the lines of an electric train vs. a human. They also have the innate ability to spout gouts of fire which are far more damaging than any 'learned' human spell. 3. Drakons have demonstrated themselves to be far more intelligent and creative than Shapers, due to the mere fact that they have made extraordinary progress in the field of Shaping in a only a few decades. It's clear that Drakons are to humans as humans are to chimpanzees. quote: They have... creative genius. You can complain that my claims are unsupported when you support your own. [/QUOTE] Jeez, you must have been asleep when playing the latter portions of GF2, GF3, and GF4. Because if I remember correctly, Drakons are masters at molding new creations. If that's not creative genius, then what the hell is? -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Friday, March 16 2007 15:22 Profile Homepage #48 Emp: quote: Try this one first. What the hell does a propensity for canister usage have to do with an organism's ability to experience a love for the arts (ergo. culture)? Once again, Emperor, please provide a shred of evidence which demonstrates that Drakon's do not have an appreciation for art. quote: As for my other reasonings, they may be opinions (logically reasonable ones) How gracious of you to admit that your statements about the Drakons are mere opinion. Although I think you're being a little generous to yourself by labelled them as 'reasonable'. Your argument pretty much amounts to "It wasn't mentioned in the game, hence it doesn't occur/exist." Once again, it wasn't mentioned in the game as to whether humans defecated, but I think it's reasonable to say that they had bowel movements. Likewise, it's been made clear that Drakons are sapient beings capable of introspection. It's not a huge stretch to conclude that given their remarkable similiarites to humans, they can experience an appreciation for art. Of course, given that they are active in a fight to topple an Empire far more powerful than their own, it's not a huge shock that we don't see Eass or Ghaldring taking some time to paint of portrait of a female Drakon they secretly admire from afar. Perhaps when the Drakons aren't being actively hunted down and exterminated, they can settle and enjoy the finer things in life. quote: like drakon have innate shaping abilites The game suggests that Drakons do indeed have innate Shaping abilities. Canister usage is not required, so it seems quite reasonable to assume that Drakons are created with the ability to Shape. DreadKnight: quote: The drakon have animal instinct, So do humans. However, it's been demonstrated time and time again that Drakons are sentient, sapient, highly intelligent beings. They have an awareness of self (introspection), and creative genius. I think it's crystal clear that Drakons aren't 'mere animals', despite their appearance. quote: Technically, the Shapers are no longer humans, More garbage from an Emp doppleganger. Last time I checked, the Shapers were a member of homo sapiens. Shapers are just humans who happen to be part of an elitist sect of society. To claim that Shapers are not human would be the equivalent of claiming that the aristocracy of medieval Europe was not human. [ Friday, March 16, 2007 15:27: Message edited by: Waylander ] -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Friday, March 16 2007 13:52 Profile Homepage #43 Emp: quote: Just because you've ignored it doesn't mean that there hasn't been plenty of evidence mentioned already. Read the thread again, I don't feel like repeating myself. Stop being pedantic. It's quite evident that you don't have a jot of evidence to support your drivel about the Drakons. If you HAVE provided such evidence, they by all means, quote it again for all to see! Remember that making assertions such as 'Drakons do not feel emotion!', with excessive emphasis, does not qualify as evidence! -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Friday, March 16 2007 13:41 Profile Homepage #41 Safey: quote: Humans are superiour to drakons because we get a long with each other . AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!! You've really made my day with that little zinger. Humans get can along with each other? That explains the rogue Shapers, and the HUMAN half of the Rebellion. -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Friday, March 16 2007 13:34 Profile Homepage #40 Nayld: quote: Waylander, your rationale is "I didn't see any drakon art in-game, so they must have it." sigh Strawman argument. Before attempting to refute your opponent, you should at least figure out what the hell they are saying. And you should try being a little less obtuse. quote: Drakons are not capable of any emotion other than pure animal instinct. Are you sure that you're not Emp's doppleganger? You're just making the same baseless assumptions, without providing a jot of evidence. But hey. I never saw the humans in Geneforge defecate either. Obviously this proves that they MUST be incapable of passing a bowel movement. [ Friday, March 16, 2007 13:37: Message edited by: Waylander ] -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Friday, March 16 2007 04:43 Profile Homepage #32 I just don't understand how anyone can deny Drakon superiority. The Drakons are the only ones in the game who have a clue about tearing the Shapers a new *****. If there were two continents of Drakons, I'm sure they would eat the Shapers for breakfast, and have room for dessert. No wonder the Drakons are so arrogant, with a superiority complex. The fact of the matter is: They are superior. -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00**
Geneforge 5: Improvements, Innovations etc in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Friday, March 16 2007 04:34 Profile Homepage #37 Geneforge 4 was definitely a huge improvement over its predecessor GF3, but the one thing which really disappointed me was that Jeff continues to retain some redundant creations. He continues to build 'sideways' (adding Wingbolts, War Tralls, etc), but leaves the **ty core creations unchanged. No-one has touched pyroroamers or battle betas since GF1, and Jeff knows it. Battle Creations in general are redundant. So why has he left them as an option to be Shaped? Why can't we have Vlish that Daze or Stun? Why not a support Vlish which can heal? Why not a Battle Beta that can intimidate enemies? Why not a pyroroamer who can hit multiple targets with a cone firebreath? Hell, I'm not a game designer, and I can think of several ways to make PC creations more fun to shape. Instead of continually adding new tiers of creations, Jeff should reform those which already can be shaped, and perhaps add a third option (eg. Vlish/Terror Vlish/Radiant Vlish). He made a partial attempt at this in GF 4 (witness the wonderful improvement to the Drakon), but some redundant creations still remain (Unstable Thahd, I'm looking at you!) -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00**
Are Drakons superior beings? in Geneforge 4: Rebellion
Suspicious Vlish Infiltrator Member # 2245	written Thursday, March 15 2007 21:37 Profile Homepage #30 Emp: quote: Do you realize how ridiculous you sound? I'm not the one making empty assumptions. "I didn't see Eass holding a paintbrush in the game, hence Drakons can't paint". Wow, watertight rationale! -------------------- VIVE LA TAKERS! VIVE LA REBELLION! VIVE LA GHALDRING! Posts: 522 \| Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00

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