Were we prepared?
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Agent
Member # 4506
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 05:59
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As many of you know now (Thanks to Princess Ruth's topic), London was bombed (multiple times). The main question was: Were we (us lot in England), prepared for this attack, or were we just plain old lax in our security. Obviously, with the G8 summit taking place, our security is low, but shouldn't that have been taken into account? Shouldn't we have expected this? QUESTION: Were we (us lot over in England) prepared? And also, who is responsible for this? People say this lot might be responsible, but a 200 word website it not much to go on. I could make that, and make it intracible in less than an hour... This lot say "WE ARE RESPONSIBLE!" Pictures (from BBC news):     I just wonder - who's next? - Archmagus Micael [ Sunday, July 10, 2005 08:32: Message edited by: Archmagus Micael ] -------------------- "You dare Trifle with Exile?" - Erika the Archmage -------------------- My Scenarios: Undead Valley : A small Undead problem, what could possibly go wrong? -------------------- Proof of Richard Black's existance: Richard Black - PROOF of his existance (the Infernal one's website). Posts: 1370 | Registered: Thursday, June 10 2004 07:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 06:41
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Unfortunately, I believe there's only a small degree of preparation possible against attacks on soft civilian targets like buses or subways. Anyone willing to give up their life can walk onto a bus or train with a backpack loaded with explosives and pull this off very easily. If it's not a suicide attack, it becomes a bit more difficult. At least in DC, everyone is very leery of bags left by themselves, and trash cans (at least in the Metro) are about as bomb proof as they can get. However, this could still very easily be accomplished in a crowded club or restaurant. [ Thursday, July 07, 2005 06:46: Message edited by: Drew ] Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 4506
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 06:53
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They don't know (as of now) if it was a suicide bombing spree or not. Their current line of thinking is that it isn't. - Archmagus Micael -------------------- "You dare Trifle with Exile?" - Erika the Archmage -------------------- My Scenarios: Undead Valley : A small Undead problem, what could possibly go wrong? -------------------- Proof of Richard Black's existance: Richard Black - PROOF of his existance (the Infernal one's website). Posts: 1370 | Registered: Thursday, June 10 2004 07:00 |
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Guardian
Member # 3521
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 08:21
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As for the question of who's responsible, it's quite likely that the group that has claimed responsibility did really carry out the bombings. However, I'm of the opinion that the attack was planned and orchestrated by the Al Qaeda organization. -------------------- Stughalf "Delusion arises from anger. The mind is bewildered by delusion. Reasoning is destroyed when the mind is bewildered. One falls down when reasoning is destroyed."- The Bhagavad Gita. Posts: 1798 | Registered: Sunday, October 5 2003 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 4506
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 08:25
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quote:Yeah. I'm of the same opinion, but there are still some nutters who think that Al'Quaeda is made up by Bush and Blair... Did anyone see how haggard and old Blair looked on that live TV broadcast. It's taken it's toll on him. - Archmagus Micael -------------------- "You dare Trifle with Exile?" - Erika the Archmage -------------------- My Scenarios: Undead Valley : A small Undead problem, what could possibly go wrong? -------------------- Proof of Richard Black's existance: Richard Black - PROOF of his existance (the Infernal one's website). Posts: 1370 | Registered: Thursday, June 10 2004 07:00 |
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Triad Mage
Member # 7
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 08:30
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He's also flown nearly around the world and probably not slept in days. -------------------- "At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander ==== Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy desperance.net - We're Everywhere ==== You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse! Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 2210
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 09:09
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This is a short analysis from the London Times. http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,22989-1684538,00.html Also, I had read that they had initially disabled the mobile phone network in London. Some of the articles in the paper said they may have set off the explosives with cell phones. So, it may not have been suicide bombers. It looks more likely to be a failure of domestic intelligence than anything else. Looking at the article, it says attacks were expected for four years. Further, it brings something closer to home, the Iraq war where daily suicide bombings happen is coming back to Britain with savagery. Al Zarqawi in Iraq is the new terrorist enemy. How do you contain a hydra where the more the fighting spreads-- the more enemies you have? There really is no such thing as over there any more. -------------------- Wasting your time and mine looking for a good laugh. Star Bright, Star Light, Oh I Wish I May, I Wish Might, Wish For One Star Tonight. Posts: 1084 | Registered: Thursday, November 7 2002 08:00 |
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Triad Mage
Member # 7
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 10:23
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Everything I've heard suggests planted bombs and nothing about suicide bombers. -------------------- "At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander ==== Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy desperance.net - We're Everywhere ==== You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse! Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00 |
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? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 10:55
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As part of the ongoing ostrich movement in the US government, one of the latest statements is that "there is no credible intelligence that a similar bombing is planned in the US." Of course that is also what was said in hindsight after the World Trade Center incident in 2001. *this message is deeply cynical and distrustful of official statements* Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 366
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 12:17
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Security in London has been heightened for over 2 years following similar bombings elsewhere. However, only a certain amount of security is possible on a public transport network with over 1 million users (myself included) everyday. Unfortunately London has been a terrorist target for years (think back to the IRA, but at least they warned us when they were going to attack), and you won't find a rubbish bin anywhere in a tube or rail station because they're so easy to hide bombs in! There are posters all over the Underground reminding people to be alert of suspicious packages, and security warnings are just part of daily life. As I said, with over 1 million users everyday it would be impossible to check everyone. Sometimes these things happen. -------------------- I say never be complete. I say stop being perfect. I say let's evolve. Let the chips fall where they may. Posts: 1277 | Registered: Sunday, December 9 2001 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 154
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 13:52
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I think we were well prepared. It looks like 'the plan' got carried out to a very good level. As for security, I couldn't say, but I don't think it's the same thing. -------------------- Inconsistently backward. SWOH. IM, PATF, ND. Posts: 612 | Registered: Saturday, October 13 2001 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 5450
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 14:22
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I originally thought that it was carried out by jealous Frenchman. It appears not, however. In the Herald Sun today, it claims that London was well prepared for the attack, but did not know when it would happen. At least 37 dead, 700 injured and around 95 seriously injured...its shocking. [ Thursday, July 07, 2005 15:29: Message edited by: Spring. Sanity Collector. ] -------------------- I'll put a Spring in your step. Polaris Posts: 2396 | Registered: Saturday, January 29 2005 08:00 |
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Master
Member # 4614
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 15:27
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That would be quite an act for some jealous Frechman. No, it was those Muslim terrorists who think the only way they'll get to heaven is by killing non-Muslims. I don't know about anyone else, but that sure sounds like Devil-talk to me. -------------------- -ben4808 For those who love to spam: CSM Forums RIFQ Posts: 3360 | Registered: Friday, June 25 2004 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 5754
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 16:29
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It's the Al Queada no dought about it. The group is probably just saying that to draw attention away from the Al Qeuada(secretly being a faniticial part of them). -------------------- I AM A MINOTAUR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I AM INVADING THE SHAPERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ALL SHALL FALL TO MY WRATH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! WHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Posts: 626 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |
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Fire! Fire! Fire! Fire!
Member # 919
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 17:48
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Ah, ze French. No, I really doubt that - they're not that crazy. Someone mentioned the Olympics, too - can't see what that has to do with anything, except that the attack raises new security issues. Well. I don't know how much can be done to prevent this kind of thing, but I wish you Londoners luck. If you discover an effective method, let the rest of the world's threatened cities know as soon as possible. Congratualtions on the Olympics. It was ironic to see celebrating crowds in the paper and then look up to my computer screen and see the more pertinent news... *sigh*. -------------------- And though the musicians would die, the music would live on in the imaginations of all who heard it. -The Last Pendragon Polaris = joy. In case of emergency, break glass. Posts: 3351 | Registered: Saturday, April 6 2002 08:00 |
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E Equals MC What!!!!
Member # 5491
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 17:54
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quote:Or possibly terrorists who want to pressure Britain to withdraw from Iraq, regardless of religious convictions. -------------------- Sex is easier than love. Posts: 1861 | Registered: Friday, February 11 2005 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 18:03
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I'm with Ash on this point — saying that these terrorists give a darn about real Islam is like saying that Stalin gave a darn about communism. The ideology is just an excuse. -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Master
Member # 4614
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 18:16
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Right. I understand that the real Muslim ideology does not encourage this kind of action, but obviously something is inspiring these terrorists to do what they're doing, and the terrorists are pretty much all Muslim of some sort or the other. Maybe twisted Muslim, but still Muslim. -------------------- -ben4808 For those who love to spam: CSM Forums RIFQ Posts: 3360 | Registered: Friday, June 25 2004 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 32
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 18:22
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It's important to remember that there are also other fundamentalists groups. Any religious extremist group can be a very dangerous thing... -------------------- Lt. Sullust Cogito Ergo Sum Polaris Posts: 2462 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 73
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 18:27
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For instance, the Spanish Christians during the Inquisition. -------------------- The Lyceum - The Headquarters of the Blades designing community The Louvre - The Blades of Avernum graphics database Alexandria - The Blades of Exile Scenario database BoE Webring - Self explanatory Polaris - Free porn here Odd Todd - Fun for the unemployed (and everyone else too) Famous Last Words - A local pop-punk band They Might Be Giants - Four websites for one of the greatest bands in existance -------------------- 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 Posts: 2957 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Thursday, July 7 2005 18:37
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quote:Uh, not exactly. The largest terrorist attack on U.S. soil prior to 9/11 was the Oklahoma City bombing, done by Timothy McVeigh, a home-grown terrorist. The largest terrorist attacks on Britain other than the most recent one were done by the IRA, an Irish radical group. Yes, there is one large multi-national terrorist organization that recruits in the name of fundamentalist Islam, but there are a substantial number of other significant terrorist threats. I wish people would talk about this more. -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Triad Mage
Member # 7
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written Friday, July 8 2005 00:46
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In Madrid, a lot of people suspected Basque separatists, but they rarely attack civilian targets. A danger in the world today is rising religious fundamentalism, regardless of the actual religion. -------------------- "At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander ==== Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy desperance.net - We're Everywhere ==== You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse! Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00 |
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This Side Towards Enemy
Member # 3098
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written Friday, July 8 2005 01:57
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I'd have to agree that there's only so much you can do. It's nearly impossible to stop the bomber getting through forever. All you can do is try to minimise the number of times it happens. Certainly, it's worth noting that (whilst we don't as yet really have any clue how many died on the bus) the death toll is certainly not going to reach three figures. That demonstrates how effective the reaction immediately after the explosions was. That at least has to be a sign of hope. There are plenty of non-Muslim terrorist groups, although I don't think you can really say that any of them have the reach of Al-Qaeda and its affiliates/subordinates. For example, the Madrid bombings were mostly blamed on Basque separatists as a piece of blatant electioneering, which backfired and led to the government losing the wave of sympathy and the then imminent general election. Part of the problem is that Islamic theology is easier to twist to justify terrorism than most other religions, part of the problem is that Islam has a large amount of followers and Al-Qaeda is rather more internationalist than most other groups. -------------------- Voice of Reasonable Morality Posts: 961 | Registered: Thursday, June 12 2003 07:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Friday, July 8 2005 08:52
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I rather suspect that any of the three cousin religions (Judaism, Christianity, Islam) could easily be twisted to justify terrorism. The economic and social conditions in several countries that are predominantly Islamic are a big factor, too. After all, how many of these terrorists are Indonesian? -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Friday, July 8 2005 10:00
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Almost none are Indonesian. Note that, although somewhat troubled and corrupt, Indonesia continues on an impressive economic expansion, creating jobs and helping to raise standards of living for its people. When people have hope, when they have viable alternatives, they stay away from extremes, no matter what faith they're a part of. Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |