What do YOU want to see in G4?

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AuthorTopic: What do YOU want to see in G4?
Infiltrator
Member # 5566
Profile #100
quote:
Originally written by Contra:

Three-creation limit? Don't you mean seven?

What he means is three types of creation you cannot make A (admittedly spelled wrong) fyora artila croyora dryak thahd battle alpha and cyrodrayk. After the fyora artila croyora it would say something like no more than three creation types there you go.
Posts: 507 | Registered: Tuesday, March 1 2005 08:00
Infiltrator
Member # 5785
Profile #101
Someone transelate, that post was beyond me.

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"..The seventh wave of Thrall stumbled and climbed over the slippery, piled dead and Mazzarin saw The Watcher with them and at last knew the number of his days."
Posts: 522 | Registered: Wednesday, May 4 2005 07:00
Warrior
Member # 3357
Profile Homepage #102
you can only have three types of creation in your party at any one time
Posts: 76 | Registered: Saturday, August 16 2003 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 5667
Profile #103
Just try it out, Contra, make a fyora, a roamer, and an artila and then try and make a vlish. It's impossible to do, but there's no good reason for it. If I want to roleplay a shaper who makes seven different creation types, then I should be able to.

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Whatever happens, happens.
Posts: 48 | Registered: Monday, April 4 2005 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 5847
Profile #104
My #1 wish would be for Jeff to expand the utility of creations beyond combat. Some ideas/examples (some have been mentioned by others already):

- A 'packbeast' creation to carry your gear
- A mount to allow you to move faster
- A creation that heals you/other creations
- A mechanic creation, that would have its own Mechanics skill
- A scout: fast, cheap, can see farther than normal
- Shaping of equipment: make your own baton or Living Tools, for example.

Oh, and Shell, I'd bet that there's a mechanical reason for it. Most likely related to how the game data is organized in memory. It's not like Jeff woke up one day and said, "hey, I'll limit them to three creation types!" He wouldn't do it without a reason.

[ Tuesday, May 31, 2005 12:30: Message edited by: Beamup ]
Posts: 20 | Registered: Thursday, May 26 2005 07:00
Infiltrator
Member # 2245
Profile Homepage #105
I would like to see a 'prequel' to Geneforge 1. Perhaps from Trajkov's perspective...

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VIVE LA TAKERS!
VIVE LA REBELLION!
VIVE LA GHALDRING!
Posts: 522 | Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Infiltrator
Member # 5785
Profile #106
I would like to see a game not focused on the Geneforge. Sick of the Geneforge, and frankly rather sick of canisters aswell. Give us something new.

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"..The seventh wave of Thrall stumbled and climbed over the slippery, piled dead and Mazzarin saw The Watcher with them and at last knew the number of his days."
Posts: 522 | Registered: Wednesday, May 4 2005 07:00
Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
Profile #107
But call it 'Geneforge IV' just to suck in the customers?

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We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty.
Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00
Infiltrator
Member # 5785
Profile #108
Yes, or something similar. The game is about Shapers, their creations and world views, not necessarily the Geneforge and canisters.

There are endless posibillity for plots here.

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"..The seventh wave of Thrall stumbled and climbed over the slippery, piled dead and Mazzarin saw The Watcher with them and at last knew the number of his days."
Posts: 522 | Registered: Wednesday, May 4 2005 07:00
Warrior
Member # 3357
Profile Homepage #109
Is it going to be gene-altering drinks next :P

Judging by the ending, there are probably going to be new, but altered by the standard magic method, creations
Posts: 76 | Registered: Saturday, August 16 2003 07:00
Warrior
Member # 5550
Profile Homepage #110
In G1 there were hints that the shapers were not the first people to do it. Also, there is evidence that serviles were not created, but enslaved by the shapers. I think these concepts should be explored more.

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Posts: 154 | Registered: Saturday, February 26 2005 08:00
Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
Profile #111
There are Shapers and then there are Shapers. That is, there are foot-soldier Shapers like Erika, stuck in the Main Army Camp, junior executives like Diwaniya, and mighty lords like Rahul -- who actually has the title 'Lord'.

Just how does Shaper society organize itself? What does it take to get onto the Shaper Council? Is the system a meritocracy, or is it an aristocracy of some sort? I wouldn't be at all surprised if the actual rulers of Shaper society had shaped themselves into superiority, and then concealed this violation of taboo from the masses of lesser Shapers.

This kind of corruption at the top of Shaper society might go a long way to explaining why so many Shapers seem to go off the deep end, doing reckless things in pursuit of personal power.

It might also open up an interesting new kind of factional conflict: honest Shapers versus corrupt elite Shapers. The elite Shapers would actually turn out to have far more in common with their Drakon enemies than they could ever afford to admit. And the 'honest' rank-and-file Shapers in turn would have some common ground with the ordinary humans and serviles who just want to throw off the unnatural Shaper yoke.

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We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty.
Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00
Infiltrator
Member # 2245
Profile Homepage #112
An all out war between Drayks and Drakkons would sure be interesting. Drayks seem to have quite a bit of resentment towards Drakkons.

Another possible scenario I would love to see is a bloodthirsty race from across the sea, who are proficient technologically (guns, cannon, golems) invading. Perhaps they use 'twisted' magick relying on death.

For the first time, Shapers and serviles would have to unite to fight a common foe. There would be division in the Shaper council on whether to use canisters, and arm serviles.

[ Friday, June 03, 2005 07:27: Message edited by: Waylander ]

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VIVE LA TAKERS!
VIVE LA REBELLION!
VIVE LA GHALDRING!
Posts: 522 | Registered: Friday, November 15 2002 08:00
Infiltrator
Member # 5754
Profile #113
That's what i was talking about with the minotaurs.
Posts: 626 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00
Infiltrator
Member # 5785
Profile #114
Yes. thank you SoT, this is what i wanted to hear from someone. The Shapers are a large organisation strentching across two large continents. Corruption is almost ensured, since Shapers are nothing but human.

Cut the Geneforge storyline and go for the Shaper-vs-Shaper storyline.

By the way, what "evidence" is there for Servile enslavement?

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"..The seventh wave of Thrall stumbled and climbed over the slippery, piled dead and Mazzarin saw The Watcher with them and at last knew the number of his days."
Posts: 522 | Registered: Wednesday, May 4 2005 07:00
Warrior
Member # 70
Profile #115
You know what i'd like to see?
Forgive me if it's been mentioned in this topic before...

I'd like to see your character with the ability to create some unique creations. Creations that show you are a true prodigy. Creations that when you walk into a town, shaper or otherwise, people start gaping in awe.

Or you're the apprentice of a Shaped Shaper, and due to an erratic experiment, you get thrown into a proto-geneforge. Instead of dying, you wake up a half-drayk with your master dead or insane near you.

With this transformation, maybe the canisters wont make you insane like they do normal Shapers, or maybe you unlock abilities as you get level up and focus your energies into 'remembering' what secrets your cells hold.

I hope my post makes sense..

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Death always wins, because the bastard cheats.
Posts: 105 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00
Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
Profile #116
There are two basic directions this kind of discussion can take. We can go 'clear blue sky', dreaming up anything that appeals to us. If there is ever a 'Blades of Geneforge' (though I sure hope they don't call it that), that could be great. Or we can keep in mind that Jeff still has to make a living, so he can't do anything that won't be reasonably commercial over an audience with a wide range of ages.

On the whole, I don't think it would be commercially viable for Spiderweb to give up too much continuity with the geneforge series. The stock elements of canisters and geneforges and the various combinations of creatures are popular and expected. If I were in Jeff's shoes, I'd be thinking that if I were going to risk cutting out such basic elements, I might as well give myself the fun of a completely blank canvas, and do something completely different from Geneforge in every way. So, I don't think really basic changes in the games are plausible for Geneforge IV.

We can of course hope to see the elements altered and combined in surprising ways that develop new themes. The many technical innovations that are the main advance of G3 open up a lot of possibilities.

So my vote would be to put ideas like minotaurs and 'no geneforge' into a thread on 'what I would do with Blades of Geneforge', and leave 'what do you want in G4' for things that Jeff can more easily afford to do in his commercial product.

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We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty.
Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #117
I'm not exactly a fan of the minotaur idea, SoT, but it's not much more far-fetched than the Vahnatai were in Exile II — and they were a huge hit. Similarly, the change from subterranean to surface in the next game was extremely drastic, yet Exile III was even more popular than its predecessors.

If Jeff wanted to get rid of the canisters, I'm sure he's capable of recombining (hee hee) the things about them that people like — the 'free' stat boosting, the corruption, the decisions — in some other commercially viable way.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
Profile #118
Hmmm. Maybe you're right. I just happen to like the geneforges, and the canisters. But maybe some variety. How about multicolored canisters, that differ in some interesting ways that I can't think of at all right now?

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We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty.
Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 5651
Profile #119
How about adding some possibility of doing the creation experimenting yourself? I mean, you get to "bombard some creations with energy" and then you might get all sorts of retarded creatures but could also get something new and powerful.

So there would also be certain abilities that certain types of energy would give.
So you could get Pyroroamers that daze nearby enemies, maybe a creation that casts some kind of spells, and all sorts of stuff, for example all the twisted creations you meet from time to time.
Static Thahds and Unstable Drakons are cool :D

And then you should record the way you did the experiment in case of a success, so you could be able to make more of them later.

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In D&D there are lots of gods. Some of them are Jesus Christ and Lucifer, and they have equal power. Players can choose either to worship one of them, and as most of them find it funny, they choose to worship Lucifer. It is one of the ways how pure souls are taken by the devil...
Posts: 29 | Registered: Thursday, March 31 2005 08:00
Infiltrator
Member # 5785
Profile #120
I always hated the Vahnatai.

Well, we can "bombard with energy". It is how we alter their stats. If you want to make an entire new creation then you must take the time to do Shaper research, have a Shaper labaratory and equipment. Research takes time, so much time that it would be utterly pointless to do it in a game, since whatever you want to prevent or help has allready died or succeded before you can bring up an even remotely succesfull creation.

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"..The seventh wave of Thrall stumbled and climbed over the slippery, piled dead and Mazzarin saw The Watcher with them and at last knew the number of his days."
Posts: 522 | Registered: Wednesday, May 4 2005 07:00
Warrior
Member # 70
Profile #121
quote:
Originally written by Contra:

I always hated the Vahnatai.

Well, we can "bombard with energy". It is how we alter their stats. If you want to make an entire new creation then you must take the time to do Shaper research, have a Shaper labaratory and equipment. Research takes time, so much time that it would be utterly pointless to do it in a game, since whatever you want to prevent or help has allready died or succeded before you can bring up an even remotely succesfull creation.

Why should it take months or years to make an entire new creation?

According to GF1 there are a ton of lost Shaping methods that people find now and again. Why cant a character find a lost laboratory with a ton of notes/canisters that help them perfect 'new' creations?

As a matter of fact, that would be pretty cool.

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Death always wins, because the bastard cheats.
Posts: 105 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00
...b10010b...
Member # 869
Profile Homepage #122
From what I recall of Jeff Vogel's very early plans for a game that sounded vaguely like Geneforge (I believe he mentioned an idea for a game where the player could create monsters even before the release of Avernum 1), it seems as if it may even have been Jeff's original intention to allow a much greater degree of fluidity in the sorts of creations that could be made.

[ Monday, June 06, 2005 01:10: Message edited by: Thuryl ]

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The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure!
Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00
Infiltrator
Member # 5785
Profile #123
If you read the explanation on how Shaping takes place (Bombard, see if there are any results [which there probably are no beneficial ones], have it gone through the beurocratic machinery of the Shapers, research if it could be dangerous..Etc) you realise how much time and how hard it would be for a mere apprentice or someone with little or no Shaping skill from the begining make an entierly new creation.

True, for Rebels it would be easier, for they can skip the last few steps and just see if the creation have evolved beneficial or not, but that step is the major one, the one that takes up most of the time.

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"..The seventh wave of Thrall stumbled and climbed over the slippery, piled dead and Mazzarin saw The Watcher with them and at last knew the number of his days."
Posts: 522 | Registered: Wednesday, May 4 2005 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 5880
Profile #124
Tell me, does anyone that is responsible for development read the forum, or should I send them email with the ideas?

1. Interface
Make more use of "Enter" key.
Scroll the screen with right mouse button.

2. Plot.
Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts completely. Shapers and the rogues are equal powers. The protagonist again is forced to choose between them only to find that there is no longer a difference: Shapers secretly negotiate with rogues to avoid war and direct confronation, to make drayks turn against drakons, while rogues treat serviles and each other just like shapers do
Posts: 17 | Registered: Friday, June 3 2005 07:00

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