The Chosen Ending - Geneforge 5
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Apprentice
Member # 7921
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written Wednesday, February 14 2007 19:07
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A Shaper assault on the Ashen Islands is plausible and makes sense. I also like the idea of the 'older' Drakons warning the Shapers of the impending doom idea. It does create interesting allies and a lot of opportunity for sides to switch, depending on the desire of the rebels and Shapers to band together or face ultimate doom. The Drayks and first generation Drakons are possible allies that may have their own hidden agenda and could turn on the Shaper/Rebel side if they had the chance to take control. The new generation Drakons would potentially have Unbound creatures at their disposal. Many options with this scenario. I like its potential. Posts: 22 | Registered: Friday, January 19 2007 08:00 |
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Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
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written Wednesday, February 14 2007 19:53
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Ghaldring will clearly be an important figure in G5, G6, or both. His true goals and feelings towards the Drakon plans and life in general are pretty ambiguous. He doesn't look like he's shaping up to be a villain. Jeff's villains are never ambiguous. They may be heroes to some and villains to others, but the lines are always fairly clear. ...on the other hand, G2 and G3 both foreshadowed him, and most of the stuff Jeff foreshadows involves villains (Garzahd, Linda, Rentar-Ihrno). I suppose the Vahnatai would be a major exception. -------------------- Slarty vs. Desk • Desk vs. Slarty • Timeline of Ermarian • G4 Strategy Central "Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said. Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Wednesday, February 14 2007 21:53
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Erika is given some foreshadowing in E1/A1 long before you meet her, and the vahnatai most definitely fit the bill of villains in fully half of the Avernum series. —Alorael, who has no idea what to make of Ghaldring without the benefit of those two games' foreshadowings. Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 549
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written Friday, February 16 2007 13:08
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I'm guessing that everything that's going to happen was forshadowed by the events on Sucia Island. They keep making more powerful and more unstable creations until civilization gets wiped out. The survivors move away and forget about Shaping. Centuries pass and the same thing happens again on another continent. Posts: 227 | Registered: Thursday, January 24 2002 08:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 8527
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written Tuesday, April 17 2007 23:33
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Here is my vision of the end of Geneforge saga. This is the way Geneforge 5 should happen: First, the game begins with a choice: Whether to start as a shaper or a rebel. Next the game begins on the other shaper continent on shaper heartlands, then advances to the shaper controlled western Terrestia, then rebel controlled eastern Terrestia and next to the Ashen islands (Or while playing a rebel in the opposite order). The activities are at the beginning cooperating with local powers and fighting infiltrators in the first two areas and then fighting the powers and cooperating with infiltrators in the second two areas. The fifth and final area is the Sucia island, where the fate of the world is decided once more. All the factions have a beachhead somewhere on the island. The story is something like this: After the unbound escalated the war, the shapers have grown a more and more desperate. Both rebels and shapers get hints that a group of shapers have disappeared and are designing a forbidden weapon that ends the war in their favor (The genuine, true, shaper made GENEFORGE!). The player is sent to find them. Then the player searches through war torn lands for clues to their trail right to the war forgotten Sucia island. He also gets offers from the other side and Trakovites to swap sides. As the player enters there he finds out that other factions have entered there and the final battle to control the Geneforge begins. When he finally reaches the Geneforge, his actions determine the result of the whole war. Endings: 1. Barzaite. The player joins with them. Uses Geneforge, doesn't destroy it, and destroys shaper council and rebel Ghaldring. Barzaites join the war and defeate both shapers and rebels, but just months later a new war begins amongst Barzaites and the world is reduced to ashes. 2. Shaper. Doesn't use Geneforge, destroys it, and destroys Barzaites and Ghaldring. Shapers maintain their honor, but lose Terrestia. The shapers fortify their one remaining continent and prepare for another war. It is only a matter of time as the drakon are at the peak of their arrogance. 3. Two Rebel ends. Doesn't destroy Geneforge, and destroys Barzaites and Shaper council. Rebels win the war. a) Doesn't use Geneforge. The drakons hog the secrets of Geneforge to themselves and they finally enslave humans for all time. b) uses Geneforge. The human rebels gain the use of Geneforge and soon a new war breaks between human rebels and drakons. The land is reduced to ashes. 4. Trakovite. Doesn't use Geneforge, destroys Geneforge, and destroys Shaper council, Ghaldring and Barzaites. Both factions lose their leaders and fall dissarray. Both factions believe the other one captured and used Geneforge. For fear of what is to come (and with drakons the fear of civil war amongst drakons) a diplomatic efforts are made to declare a truce. An uneasy peace follows with both sides preparing for a new war. A new war is only a question of time. 5. Over powered one. Use Geneforge, destroy Geneforge, and destroys barzaites, shaper council and Ghaldring. The player takes fate into his own hands. Shapers fall and rebels will follow. All shall fight against this new power, but the war can end only one way. The world will be at peace for a long time. The new empire brings forth prosperity as it follows a very democratic doctrine: One man, one vote. The player is the man, and he has the vote. Anyway, this is my vision of the perfect end for the Geneforge 5. This saga cannot end with anything else, but the player determining the fate of the world. IMHO [ Tuesday, April 17, 2007 23:37: Message edited by: Kalkin ] Posts: 2 | Registered: Wednesday, April 18 2007 07:00 |
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Guardian
Member # 5360
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written Wednesday, April 18 2007 12:21
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That seems a bit too. . . well, big for Spiderwebs' budget. The reappearance of Sucia is doubtful, since an entire game was on that one island. The resurfacing of Terrestria is doubtful as well, since players want something refreshing and new. The Barzite faction has been eliminated, and won't return with any influence, much to Tully's despair. Since this is the end of the series, Jeff will want something a bit more extravagant and complex than what you outlined. -------------------- Fear us, mortals, but never envy, for though we burn with power, our fuel is our sorrows. Posts: 1636 | Registered: Wednesday, January 5 2005 08:00 |
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Board Administrator
Member # 1
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written Wednesday, April 18 2007 13:05
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"First off, which ending do you think will be chosen?" Well, that will be up to the player, won't it? - Jeff Vogel -------------------- Official Board Admin spidweb@spiderwebsoftware.com Posts: 960 | Registered: Tuesday, September 18 2001 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 7420
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written Wednesday, April 18 2007 13:39
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quote:It's good to see I'm not the only one that wants to see the Barzites come back. I like the idea of choosing the faction from the begining, it would make it more like Nethergate. It makes it seem more like multiple games in one, despite that not being the case. In each zone, your objectives would be determined by your faction, instead of you being able to work for multiple faction to almost no limit in a single game. -------------------- You lose. Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 4039
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written Wednesday, April 18 2007 15:50
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Come to think of it, it would be relatively easy to let the player choose what happened in G5. In the old games you had to kill the big bad guy to get a given ending, but all you did in G4 was push buttons at a control panel. Maybe that would be the opening scene in G5, after the final Battle, its your job (as a shaper or rebel) to work the panel…. Posts: 5 | Registered: Friday, February 27 2004 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 7143
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written Wednesday, April 18 2007 15:52
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quote:Does that mean we actually get to choose from the begining this time? This is what I like, Loyal to the Shapers all game! :D -------------------- "After I'm dead I'd rather have people ask why I have no monument than why I have one." - Cato the Elder (234-149 BC) "When one fights a monster, one must take care not to become a monster oneself." -Friedich Nietzche "One should die proudly when it is no longer possible to live proudly." -Friedich Nietzche Posts: 333 | Registered: Saturday, May 20 2006 07:00 |
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Guardian
Member # 5360
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written Wednesday, April 18 2007 15:59
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No, thankfully. Most people want the option to maintain a more moderate position. Nalyd himself thinks the Shapers are too strict in their laws. Not evilly, soul-crushingly strict, but simply frustrating. -------------------- Fear us, mortals, but never envy, for though we burn with power, our fuel is our sorrows. Posts: 1636 | Registered: Wednesday, January 5 2005 08:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Friday, April 20 2007 02:13
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I think Jeff just meant that the player would determine the final ending to the entire series. That is, I think he missed the fact that we were asking about the starting point to G5, not its end. It might be cool to be able to choose the starting point in G5, but I think it would actually be a bad idea. I like the feeling of starting the game with a definite situation in the world, and then affecting it with my actions. A Nethergate-like option to play the same plot from either side would be better. But a plot with more branching and nonlinear feedback would be best of all. -------------------- Listen carefully because some of your options may have changed. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 7420
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written Friday, April 20 2007 07:29
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It's tough to have that non-linear plot and still make it well developed. Geneforge 4 had a great plot, but it was more linear than previous games. Geneforge 2 was the least linear, but it also had less plot. -------------------- You lose. Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 8540
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written Friday, April 20 2007 09:02
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I hope in Geneforge 5 they bring back the origanal shaper and guardians Posts: 2 | Registered: Friday, April 20 2007 07:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 8540
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written Friday, April 20 2007 09:28
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also the endings I think should happen in geneforge 5 are:#1 you have been true to the shapers you have resisted the enymy's power and rewards you have resisted the Geneforge you have been awarded by the council for what you have done in the end you become very wealthy powerful, and you become part of the shaper council. #2 you have been modified by the Geneforge, and no one trusts you any more, but every one knows not to anger you go into the woods never to return the shaper council send thousands of shapers, guardians, and agents to kill you none of them return soon the shaper council ignores you you make hoards of creations and they all live as long as you do and you live for a very long time...The End -------------------- I like the Guardians and shapers from Geneforge, and Geneforge 2 becase they look cool and powerful. Posts: 2 | Registered: Friday, April 20 2007 07:00 |
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Board Administrator
Member # 1
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written Friday, April 20 2007 10:49
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The beginning of Geneforge 5 will involve spectacular devasation. The end of the series will be up to you. There will be a large selection of possibilities. Including, of course, even more spectacular devastation. - Jeff Vogel -------------------- Official Board Admin spidweb@spiderwebsoftware.com Posts: 960 | Registered: Tuesday, September 18 2001 07:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Friday, April 20 2007 11:01
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For me 'non-linear' is physics-speak. I don't mean so much that it should offer a wide open sprawl of many things to do, but that things you do should change the world you encounter later. In a sense that makes for sprawl, because it raises the number of very different paths that can be taken through the game. But along any one of them, the number of available choices at any time may still be rather small. For me that's okay. Too many options at any given time is hard to handle in an RPG, because either most of them are too hard for you right now, in which case you don't really have many options; or else some of them will be cakewalks when you come back to them after gaining six levels while following the other choices first. -------------------- Listen carefully because some of your options may have changed. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 6785
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written Friday, April 20 2007 11:46
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quote:This ought to warm ET's icy heart. He can finally destroy all who oppose him in a massive devastation. Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 8542
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written Friday, April 20 2007 12:35
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My idea is based on the trakovite ending: Both factions are struggling for victory, and both the shapers and rebels are getting desperate to win this war. On the mountainsides of western terrestia however, an old and forgotten sect still lives. They bellonged to the primitive people who once inhabited all of terrestia, but got wiped out by the shapers and were (supposedly) extinct. These people had a very strong connection with death and the spirit world and had the power to summon powerful spirits and bind them to their will. The shapers and rebels, upon discovery of this long forgotten tribe journey to the mountains to take their power for their own. What else could be better than summoning the dead as new (recruits) for the war? Both sides tried to obtain that power for their own using different methods: - The shapers tried to trade knowledge with them, teaching them how to shape the most basic creations, inevitably causing a great number of rogue creations roaming the lands; - The serviles and human part of the rebel faction used canisters to bribe them, causing many of them to become mad and aggressive, even to their own people, while the arrogant drakons threatened them into giving up their secrets, eventually findind out that creations didn't have the power to "spiritbind" (the ability to create spirits and bind them into this world"). Unfortunately for the drakons both the mad and still sane part of the sect had a large number of spirits which trapped the drakons in the mountains. The drakons tried to resist at first, destroying many spirits and their masters, but their forces weren't very large and they were forced to scatter and hide in the mountains. Right, heres were the story begins: These mountains are now filled with rogue creations made by rebels, shapers and the sect members trying to use their newfound powers, sect members maddened by the power of the cannisters, who became aggressive against everyone, even their own, and also confused spirits who lost the connection to their former masters and now attack anything they see. You are not a shaper or a rebel, instead you are part of this sect. Your small village is attacked by a horde of fleeing drakons and you must escape. You find a cannister and you learn how to shape. A new addition is that you can also "spiritbind" or "spirit shape" or whatever, giving you necromantic powers (raising spirits, maybe half creation, half dead abominations too) adding many more options to the gameplay. Your mission is too reach the main city of (dunno the name), the last bastion for the still sane part of your sect, and until then you are contacted by the shapers, who scorn you at first for using forbidden magic (necromancy) and having used a canister too, but also know that you can be of use to them, by the human and servile part of the rebellion, who offer you cannisters and power if you help them destroy the shapers in the mountains, and even the maddened sect members (who are similar to the barzites, making huge armies of rogue creations and using every canister they find) giving you the opportunity to join them and embrace true power. The drakons play a minor role in this story as they are hated by the sect, by the shapers and by the rebels who have no love for them, giving you freedom to kill them (it will be hard to help them in any way as their arrogance is too great). In the end you would discover a geneforge made by the maddened sect who were aided by the leader of the drakon expedition, [insert name here], giving you the possibility to use it, destroy it, etc Possible endings could be: Shaper: You destroy the geneforge, you don't use it and you kill mad sect members and rebels - The shapers are indebted with your help and with the knowledge you gave them. With it, they summoned armies of dead and rallied them against the unbound. No matter how powerful they were, the unbound couldn't stand against every single "casualty" the war had until now. In the end the rebels were destroyed, but the cruel shapers, considering necromancy a forbidden art, destroyed your people and every evidence they could find that it ever existed including you (if you took canisters) or they spared you because of your service to the shapers as long as you promised to never use necromancy ever again (if you took almost no canisters). Rebels: You help the human part of the rebellion rally an immensely powerful army of creations and spirits, that was taken into shaper territory. However the rebels knew best and eradicated drakons and the unbound too, as they had become too dangerous. You and your people were well compensated for you service and you became know to everyone, however the canisters and the power they represented was to great for someone like you, and in the end you became mad and obsessed with power, striking fear into everyone who crossed your ways. In the end you were sent into exile so that you caused no further damage (using canisters), or you achieved a great position of influence in the rebel society. you acquired a great deal of wealth and power and you were remembered as one of the great saviors of the rebellion. Madness: You joined the mad part of the sect and used the geneforge. Soon after information started to escape of your doings and both rebel and shaper factions tried to stop you and your new faction from gaining power, however by the time they got there you and many others had already bathed in the awesome power of the geneforge. The war didn't last long as you side came victorious. The next years were marked by the fall of the shapers and rebels. The earth was scorched and all that remained were blasted landscapes and horrid abominations roaming the earth. You and your brethren however were too powerful to care. No rogue dared to get near any of you, and even if any new faction could arise from the ashes, it stood no chance against an army of gods. In time you became immune to disease, to weapons and even to age itself, at the cost of sanity. Petty struggles within your own sects started to arise and in the end nothing was left, except for a small band of outcasts who had spent the last years hiding from your tyranny, who now had to rebuild an entire world and avoid extinction. geneforge: You used the geneforge and destroyed it, along with all the other sects, and escaped by yourself out the mountains - You became the most powerful being in the world, capable of summoning dead and creating living servants, making you almost a god. information of your deeds ran across the land and both the shapers and rebels tried to use you for your purposes, but you prefered to erect your own kingdom and destroy all other factions. In the end you were able to shape yourself so profoundly using both shaping and necromantic magic that you were able to evade even death. You kingdom lasted for countless centuries, as nothing could oppose you. You lived shrouded by your own ego and insanity forever, ruling a kingdom of slaves bound to your demented will, and you lived for a very, very long time. I didn't specify names for the sect or anything else cause im not good at making them up. I´m portuguese and i didn't check my spelling, so im sorry for any grammar errors I think this would be a good change of plot for geneforge as you would be seeing the war from another perspective, also you could explore more into the old sects and their powerful magic, and it would also give a good ending for the story (of course if jeff wanted the war to continue, he could just write: BUT others from your sect survived and joined with the shapers and rebels, also giving their knowledge to them and bla bla bla long war.... I really don't wanna read my post as it is VERY long, so i apologize of something's unclear, or anything. Posts: 16 | Registered: Friday, April 20 2007 07:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 8542
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written Friday, April 20 2007 13:12
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Oh and about spirit shaping: It would basically be like magic shaping or battle shaping or whatever, giving you the power to shape creatures,but this time combining the power to raise the dead with the ability to use essence to augment them and make them resilient enough for combat. Examples would be: Shape Shade (shades are immune to poison) Shades are ghosts brought back using special rituals, and in this case, strengthened by using essence. They are hard to hit and have a slowing cold touch, but have low hitpoints Shape lvl 3 Shade - Wraith Wraiths are an improved version of shades, much more essence is used in augmenting them, making them easier to be hit, but giving them a much more powerful attack and more hitpoints Shape Golem A golem is a shaper creation, an empty shell which can be used to bind a spirit. Golems host a powerful shade within them, giving them more power and intelligence than the normal golem. Golems can take a lot of punishment before they die and their fists can hit hard making them powerful creations. Shape lvl 3 golem - Oozing golem Unlike the normal golems, these golems have been infused with special essence to spread acid against attackers through wounds. These golems have immunity to acid and poison and spread acid to all nearby attackers when damaged. etc etc. you know my point make 3 more creations that are connected with the spirit world and voila a new kind of shaping that can only be acquired by "regular" learning, and not by canisters, used by the sects of old is created. Also the character choices could be: Ritualist - shaping: strong magic: average combat: weak Channeler - shaping: average magic: strong combat: weak Eremite - shaping: weak magic: strong combat: average Paladin (yea i know the name isn't the best, but i can't come up with anything better) shaping: weak magic: average combat:strong meh just some ideas hope you like them Posts: 16 | Registered: Friday, April 20 2007 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 7420
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written Friday, April 20 2007 15:53
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quote:Should we assume this means the Rebels win Geneforge 4 and unleash the unbound? Good. I want the Rebels to be in power for a little while so people can see just how horrible life under drakons would really be. They will beg for the return of order. They might even turn to extremists like me to give it to them. -------------------- You lose. Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Friday, April 20 2007 18:35
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I see we've just been graced by the presence of the great Atlantean god of... of... deceit! -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 8542
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written Friday, April 20 2007 23:51
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i see we have another indy fan here ;) Posts: 16 | Registered: Friday, April 20 2007 07:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 5930
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written Saturday, April 21 2007 07:05
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If Trakovites ever gain power, a more extreme faction would end up hunting down and repressing any magic or shaping. Intrinsically magical beings might have lower class status or worse. I wonder if for a while there would be magic suppressing artifact creation for Trakovites attempting to defeat magic users. Otherwise, I'm not sure how they'd be able to gain the upper hand against a concentrated force of magic users. I would think they would suspect any use of magic or magic artifacts and might not want to resort to it. Perhaps some mental based discipline would emerge, though those cults never seem to turn out well in the game. Posts: 7 | Registered: Thursday, June 9 2005 07:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 4278
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written Saturday, April 21 2007 07:44
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G5 = You are a lone Eyebeast with Down Syndrome wandering the ruins of Terrestria in the Aftermath of the war, when you come upon a working geneforge... -------------------- Pathological Jerk Jerking at Spiderweb since 1999 Posts: 143 | Registered: Sunday, April 18 2004 07:00 |