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An insane idea, but... in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #9
And you missed out on the most obvious - clawbugs to chitrachs! But convenienty vlish and glaakhs are missing.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
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Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
The Crystal Soul theft in The Avernum Trilogy
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #16
There is a little bit of Vahnatai info on the approach to Grah-Hoth in Exile I (v2.0), but who knows if it was in 1.0.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
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Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
G2 question. in Geneforge Series
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #1
Parry and/or Dexterity.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #125
quote:
Originally written by Slarty:

quote:
Originally written by Drakefyre:

It would also mean Starrus was crowned in 851 IE and he was born in 838 IE. When Micah was 81. Not to mention the fact that there's never any queen of Avernum or anything. And to say that Micah lived any longer than that is really stretching it.

So I think it's fair to say that Micah was dead for the majority of the Second Slith War.

I agree with your conclusion, but doesn't Rone (or somebody) mention that Micah gave in to life-extending magic in order to continue to serve Avernum, while he had no heir? That makes his old age seem less improbable.

Magic could also answer the concern about the lack of a queen. Avernum's answer to immaculate conception I guess!

quote:
Originally written by Drakefyre:

There is never any specific mention of a gap government between Micah and Houghton, but I assume that there was something, since the Council ruled alongside Micah but is not in existence in Avernum 4. Something happened that we don't know about...
No, no. Somebody in A4 *definitely* talks about the demise of the Council. I don't remember if it was Houghton or Starrus or or Rone or Kelner or someone in the castle or maybe even someone random like Angarahad, but somebody explains it. A good summary is in this Encyclopedia Ermariana article which, ironically enough, you (Drakey) wrote. :P

Top: I said that to explain why he lived so long.

Bottom: I searched for "council" in the Avernum 4 text and got four references to the Olgai Council. I could have sworn that someone talked about it including one of the mayors, but I guess not.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
E2: Barrier Tunnel in The Exile Trilogy
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #6
You need the orders from (I think) the Olgai Council.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
The Crystal Soul theft in The Avernum Trilogy
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #14
It wasn't so much a good connection as "We'll give you lots of gold for a crystal soul." Gaddika already had his own separate fortress and was easily identifiable as a rebel.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
The Crystal Soul theft in The Avernum Trilogy
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #12
Well, I think they mention that they knew about the demons and sliths at least, but whether that came from scrying or the FE I don't know.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
The Crystal Soul theft in The Avernum Trilogy
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #10
I'm pretty sure they sent some info back, or else they wouldn't have known what to expect when they sent down victims.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
selling items in Tech Support
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #3
In Geneforge 1, merchants have a limited supply of coins - if the items you try to sell are worth too much, you won't be able to sell them.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
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Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
What is inspiring you? in General
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #18
I actually did play a lot of goalie indoors. The smaller goals and faster pace suit me better. Especially since I'm all reflexes.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
What is inspiring you? in General
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #15
Soccer, track, ultimate frisbee, and volleyball, in no particular order.

I played a lot of goalie for soccer but I never stuck with it because I was one of our team's best defenders, so the defense was in shambles when I went in goal. One game our other two keepers were sick or injured, so I played. We lost 6-1 to the team at the top of the league, but I had at least 20 saves and stopped a PK.

Music gets me so pumped for every sport I play. It turns me into the kind of person I need to be when I play - absolutely ruthless and taking advantage of every ounce of speed and heart.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #122
After looking over Avernum 4 again (and some of my beta correspondence with Jeff), I agree that Rentar does do more than a lot of people give her credit for. When talking with Ghall-Ihrno (I think) and Rentar, you find out why she lost her support among the Vahnatai - she made herself a crystal soul after teh Olgai Council denied her "immortality".

And Jeff says Avernum 4 is 20-30 years after Avernum 3.

There is never any specific mention of a gap government between Micah and Houghton, but I assume that there was something, since the Council ruled alongside Micah but is not in existence in Avernum 4. Something happened that we don't know about, whether it was the Council stepping in after Micah, Houghton stepping in after Micah, Chevyn stepping in after Micah (although I doubt it), or something else.

EDIT: Happy Kel? That post up there took me 2 hours, and the reason I never gave you evidence before was I never had any of the games installed (besides BoE/BoA) on my computer. But thanks to Slarty's text dumps, I can just search them quickly!

[ Friday, September 15, 2006 15:19: Message edited by: Drakefyre ]

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #116
*downloads BoA and Avernum 4*

Houghton was regent for Starrus for the past 8-9 years. This comes from Avernum 4 - Starrus was 14 when he became king (Bagli in Fort Draco), and is in his "early twenties" now.

Pea Eye says the Second Slith War was "not too many years ago".

Captain Matos says he was born right after the Second Slith War.

ZKR says the war started a little while after half of the Avernites moved to the surface. Assuming this took about 5 years, that places the beginning of the war around 838 IE.

Za-Khazi Run is set in 845 IE. The war lasts longer than this (Pea Eye says he started doing the Run for a while after the adventurers cleared the route).

Micah was 76 at the end of Avernum 3 in 833 IE (this is a conservative estimate - it assumes he was 20 when he became King). This is backed up by the history book in Patrick's Tower (for Av1 - 817 IE) saying Micah had been ruling for 40 years.

If we assume Starrus was born just after Avernum 3 (since there was no mention of him in the previous 3 games), that puts Avernum 4 at around 855 IE (which is really the earliest it could possibly be). This is important, because there are a lot of really old commanders who we first saw in Exile I or II - Mairwen, Commander Johnson, Houghton, etc., not even counting the mages. The games frequently mention that life expectancies in the caves are shorter than those on the surface, due to the hazardous environment.

If we say that Avernum 4 takes place in 860 IE, that could make Captain Matos 22 at the oldest if we assume that he meant he was born not too long after it *started*. It would also mean Starrus was crowned in 851 IE and he was born in 838 IE. When Micah was 81. Not to mention the fact that there's never any queen of Avernum or anything. And to say that Micah lived any longer than that is really stretching it.

So I think it's fair to say that Micah was dead for the majority of the Second Slith War.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
What is inspiring you? in General
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #4
I am inspired by music and competition. I have a pump-up playlist that never fails to get me amped and ready to tackle whatever it is I need to tackle. And competition always gets me fired up - getting the best of some chump makes my day.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
Musing on Avernum in General
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #15
I play lots of CM 03/04 or FM2006 (soccer management sims) and switch between them and spidweb games.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #108
quote:
Originally written by Emperor Tullegolar:

Second Slith War: Oh... I remember now. How do you know that Micah was already dead at that point? Or is that part of you guys' fan fiction time line?
It's set at a time where Houghton was regent for Starrus - only a few years before Avernum 4.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #103
quote:
Originally written by Thuryl:

quote:
Originally written by Drakefyre:

Would you buy a computer game where the character was already defined for you and sometimes spoke and acted in ways that you would never do?
There's a rather successful series of RPGs called Final Fantasy. You may perhaps have heard of it. Whether you personally like that style of game or not, it's hard to argue with sales figures.

I said *computer* game :P

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #96
You forget that the Council ruled Avernum during the Second Slith War. They didn't do a bad job there.

And when did I beat Jeff's ideas into the ground? Rentar coming back makes sense but is disappointing. Chevyn being a puppet for the Darkside Loyalists and being accepted as king just doesn't make sense given what we know about Avernum.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #94
Where do you get that from what I said?

I said that Avernum would not have *existed* without him. Would it have survived if he had stepped down after creating it? Absolutely. Besides, he was not an absolute ruler. He shared half of the power with the Council of Avernum. This balance shifted after he died - first the Council had all of the power, and then Starrus/Houghton had all of the power.

I don't agree that the figurehead and virtuous leader are interchangeable. It worked with Starrus as a figurehead, but it wouldn't with Chevyn. Anyone could visit the Castle to make a claim or request, and Chevyn wandered around the halls telling anyone who'd listen about how he'd make his lizard his prince after he became king.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #92
Avernum ended up with a monarchy because MICAH MADE AVERNUM. Micah was a warrior who united the people who had been Exiled and created the nation.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
Shapers keeping secrets in Geneforge Series
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #64
Serviles can get magical powers through self-flagellation.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #87
I'm not talking about how it was done, I'm talking about fundamental things about the world of Avernum. Like this:
quote:
I also assume that Chevyn's ineptitude, while well known by Castle officials, was kept largely from the public.
This just simply isn't true. Pretty much everyone knew Chevyn was a simpleton. The games state this. Chevyn masterminding a revolt would be extremely suspicious.

Just because someone isn't a murderer or rapist (the people in the Abyss) doesn't mean they aren't dangerous. There are plenty of surface revolutionaries in Avernum. They may not all be physically dangerous, but dangerous to the society supported by the Empire, certainly.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
drakon question in Geneforge Series
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #1
I don't think that you can shape Ur-Drakons in Geneforge 3.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #85
Roses of Reckoning is not good in the BoE or BoA version. There are many scenarios that are much better for both.

Tullegolar, I think you're not giving the people of Avernum enough credit. They were obviously dangerous enough to warrant being Exiled, and they are hardy enough to survive in the caves. And no, I don't like the idea of Chevyn being a puppet king controlled by the Darkside Loyalists - how would that even happen? When it was his turn to rule, nobody, NOT EVEN MICAH, would have allowed it. That's why the Council of Avernum ruled until Houghton made everyone accept Starrus as king. If anything, Houghton is your puppetmaster, despite being a loyal servant to Micah and Avernum for decades.

EDIT: I think you're letting your imagination run wild and are now contradicting things explicitly stated and referenced in the games. The Avernum you're talking about and one I know seem to be different places.

Also, I think that book villain and computer game villains are different. In books, people often end up having inner demons and a lot of self-conflict. This doesn't work for a computer game where the user creates their own character. It works for scenarios, which are shorter adventurers that come for free. But a "commercial" (I'm using this term loosely) game can't do that with the same freedom. Would you buy a computer game where the character was already defined for you and sometimes spoke and acted in ways that you would never do?

The same applies for villains. In books authors can define exactly what everyone does. In any good computer game the user will be able to change things and impact events. The programmers will have to account for every possible action of the player. Although it seems backwards, there's a lot less flexibility in a computer game.

[ Wednesday, September 13, 2006 15:26: Message edited by: Drakefyre ]

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00
How would you do it? in Avernum 4
Triad Mage
Member # 7
Profile Homepage #81
And Geneforge proves that you can defeat villains without killing them and the game doesn't suffer.

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"At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander
====
Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy
Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet
====
You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse!
Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00

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