If canisters were real...
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Shaper
Member # 7420
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 15:50
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I don't think you need to worry about your immune system turning on you. After all, as long as the change effects the genes in every single cell in your body, what's left to reject it? The change becomes a part of you, changing you from within, and the immune system is only irritated by invasion from without. What would be interesting to see are the long term effects of self shaping. No one has lived long enough after having used these things to see whether or not they have deadly side effects. War veterans will be coming back to sue Ghaldring's ass off once they find out they've been diagnosed with cancer... everywhere. If only that Danette had left better notes behind. Stupid woman. Then again, shaping is pretty powerful, and I don’t see why a cure for cancer couldn’t be developed with shaper resources. -------------------- You lose. Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 7143
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 17:33
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The Southforge Geneforge was a bit of a disappointment to me. After all the rebels did to get one, that was all that it could do? I got the feeling that the original geneforge basically made you a god, sure it only gave you those +10 bonuses immediately, but I got the feeling that the full effects don't happen until you reach the mainland and create your empire. -------------------- "After I'm dead I'd rather have people ask why I have no monument than why I have one." - Cato the Elder (234-149 BC) "The mind, if it exists, is nothing but an unfortunate after effect of the brain process." -Kripke "One should die proudly when it is no longer possible to live proudly." -Friedich Nietzche Posts: 333 | Registered: Saturday, May 20 2006 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 7420
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 17:45
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I have a feeling that the rebel ending in Geneforge 3 happened. That would mean that the Drakons have their very own super geneforge back on the Ashen Isles. You can't blame them for making the ones on the mainland weak. After all, they were ment for 'lesser' species. I hate drakons. I also miss the Geneforge 1 geneforge. -------------------- You lose. Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 7735
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 18:22
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Well the G1 Geneforge needed to be more powerful, because the level limit was significantly lower than the other games, especially if you're a Taker with the amulet. Posts: 107 | Registered: Monday, December 4 2006 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 7298
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 18:40
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So the rebels have two geneforges and they still can't win? They must really be pathetic. -------------------- A rock has weight whether you admit it or not Posts: 479 | Registered: Wednesday, July 12 2006 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 7298
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 18:46
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From what you say I think the orginal geneforge was a test of shaper might made at the height of shaper power dureing peace time with no resource sucking war. These other geneforges were made in hideing with much more limited resources of course their not going to give you the god like power of the orginal. Super weapons are not easy to make. Cheap mans version are going to be powerd down. [ Thursday, December 28, 2006 19:41: Message edited by: Lord Safey ] -------------------- A rock has weight whether you admit it or not Posts: 479 | Registered: Wednesday, July 12 2006 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 7420
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 19:11
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No, the rebellion sucks because it's led by creations. See what happens when creations have rights? Making yourself an autocratic ruler is one thing, but they're not even any good at it! The Tullegolites would never have this problem. Creations must be put in their place. Technology must be allowed to progress free of the drakon perversions. -------------------- You lose. Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 2820
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 19:31
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The Tullegolites would suffer from too much hubris to stop bickering and start preparing for the imminent blitzkrieg that for some reason all the arrogant generals have deemed insignificant. Believing in one's own nonexistent ability to command is far more pathetic than poorly leading a revolution against oppression. Drakons running around free, though, is probably worse than letting the shapers rule. This is probably a dumb question, but since I have not played much past Geneforge 1, I do not know whether there is a sect that opposes the Shapers without advocating creations' rights. Is there such a group? Regarding the immune system issue, an autoimmune response is by definition the body attacking itself, regardless of the fact that the attacking cells and the cells they attack share the same genetic material. Cancer and other, horrible unforeseen consequences are arguably acceptable risks in the pursuit of genetic perfection. If something went wrong, shape some more to correct the problem and hope that you do not turn into a pile of goo. -------------------- Thuryl: I mean, most of us don't go around consuming our own bodily fluids, no matter how delicious they are. ==== Alorael: War and violence would end if we all had each other's babies! ==== Drakefyre: Those are hideous mangos. Posts: 1415 | Registered: Thursday, March 27 2003 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 7298
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 19:46
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I wasn'ts saying their are weak beacues of their weak geneforges I'm saying their weak inspite of thier genforges. -------------------- A rock has weight whether you admit it or not Posts: 479 | Registered: Wednesday, July 12 2006 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 7298
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 19:51
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be kind of funny if some one made a cannister that gave you an immune system so strong that it prevent new canisters from modifying your DNA. I make hundreds of them and leave them in places canister slurpers will find. Then wait for the angry hoard of mad canister uber shapers. -------------------- A rock has weight whether you admit it or not Posts: 479 | Registered: Wednesday, July 12 2006 07:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 7735
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 20:20
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quote:That my friend, is a great idea. :) Posts: 107 | Registered: Monday, December 4 2006 08:00 |
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Councilor
Member # 6600
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 20:21
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Originally by Garrison: quote:The Barzites in G2, led by Barzahl and based in a city called Rising, had such a stance. If you've been paying attention to Emperor Tullegolar, you know their philosophy well, because the Tullegolites are basically just Barzites with a new name and leader. There's a reason Emperor Tullegolar is based in New Rising. :P Edit: Lord Safey, no more double posts please. If you have something else to say, edit your old post instead. Dikiyoba. [ Thursday, December 28, 2006 20:22: Message edited by: Dikiyoba ] Posts: 4346 | Registered: Friday, December 23 2005 08:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 7735
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 20:24
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quote:It does explain much, but Barzhal was never an emperor. :) I just hate Barzites in one way: they give canisters to anyone. They should only give to the truly worthy and loyal, such as a Barzite shaper. Posts: 107 | Registered: Monday, December 4 2006 08:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 7472
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 20:40
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The Barzites wouldn't have shapers if they didn't hand canisters out. Except for Barz(ah/ha)l. -------------------- This post is sponsored by Barzite Bonanza Bazaar. Hundreds of quality canisters for low, low prices! -------------------- Scenarios need reviews! Please rate these scenarios at the CSR after playing them! Amnesia • Dilecia • The Empire's New Grove • Express Delivery Twilight Valley • Witch Hunt • Where the Rivers Meet • Foul Hordes Posts: 2686 | Registered: Friday, September 8 2006 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 7298
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 21:53
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They did try to pick the best but in the end I think they lacked training. Even in Geneforge one you still get a lot of training. I think that it shows that pure training vs pure agumenation and pure training wins out. However agumenation in addition to training is very powerful but you must not sarifice training at the sake of agumenation. This was the Barzites weakness. [ Thursday, December 28, 2006 21:57: Message edited by: Lord Safey ] -------------------- A rock has weight whether you admit it or not Posts: 479 | Registered: Wednesday, July 12 2006 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 7420
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 22:10
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The key difference between Tullegolites and Barzites is that I support a meritocracy, whereas Barzahl, as Good Canisters pointed out, does not. He prefers to just give canister to any idiot passing by as long as they'll cause trouble for his enemies. Sloppy. Plus, it makes the power less coveted if you just give it away. Canisters must be earned through valor and loyalty. However, Barzahl was in a desperate situation, so looking back, I can forgive him. -------------------- You lose. Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 7143
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 22:37
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But Barzahl didn't have time to properly train/recruit people. He was racing against the clock against all the other factions. I bet if he was alone in the mountains he would have been very selective. -------------------- "After I'm dead I'd rather have people ask why I have no monument than why I have one." - Cato the Elder (234-149 BC) "The mind, if it exists, is nothing but an unfortunate after effect of the brain process." -Kripke "One should die proudly when it is no longer possible to live proudly." -Friedich Nietzche Posts: 333 | Registered: Saturday, May 20 2006 07:00 |
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Canned
Member # 7704
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written Thursday, December 28 2006 23:40
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To describe your humanity is quite difficult but i think it a sain man that hasn't used any drugs and canisters and that his state of mind hasn't been to much shocked or suffered. But the early shapers could change your mind and perfect it but that knowledge is not lost some canisters perfect your mind it would increase your ability but take of your reason. A mind without the fundamental bases that make you survive in the animal world and that i essential to altruism. That is humanity for my point of view . [ Thursday, December 28, 2006 23:41: Message edited by: opon mars ] -------------------- You can jump off a bridge, fire a gun in your mouth, drink poison,or going in to the tiger's pit but you will still end up dead it's a mater of time and how . Posts: 312 | Registered: Sunday, November 26 2006 08:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 7276
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written Friday, December 29 2006 07:05
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Re: Barzahl, also, don't forget that he had used so many canisters himself as to carry his arrogance far beyond anything we can easily imagine. The notion that anybody else, even another canister user, could be a real threat to him was simply inconceivable. (The same went for his obnoxious Guardian, whom I assume we all killed simply to "clean the gene pool," no matter what our views on the Shapers in general.) That no doubt gave him a much more relaxed attitude to sharing than any of us would have while we were still ourselves. Re: Ideologies, to my mind one of the interesting aspects of the game is that there is really no faction I can completely sympathize with, not even the Awakened (due to the means they want to use). It's a little like working and voting for real-life candidates instead of the ones we really want to see. Posts: 63 | Registered: Tuesday, July 4 2006 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 7298
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written Friday, December 29 2006 07:49
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The main problem I have with canisters is not the fact they make you ruthless. Its the fact they make you inceridably arrogant. It is a very serious character flaw that makes you over look threats and can hammpers your ability to work in fruitful organiztions and ruin powerful allainces. Which is why I would choose to use canisters in moderation should they truley exist. Almost every person who went all out on canisters failed because they under estimiated their oppents and over estiamted their own abilities. -------------------- A rock has weight whether you admit it or not Posts: 479 | Registered: Wednesday, July 12 2006 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 3442
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written Friday, December 29 2006 09:10
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I'd use lots and then edit a SDF so that I would have actually used none. Seriously though, I don't know if I'd use them. People can be manipulated in ways not involving raw power, and I've always been good with words... -------------------- And when you want to Live How do you start? Where do you go? Who do you need to know? Posts: 2864 | Registered: Monday, September 8 2003 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 2820
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written Friday, December 29 2006 09:45
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The ones who use the canisters will be able to kill off many of the purists who do not. However, they will probably kill each other in the long run as well, so the purists win in the end I suppose. It just may take a very, very long time. -------------------- Thuryl: I mean, most of us don't go around consuming our own bodily fluids, no matter how delicious they are. ==== Alorael: War and violence would end if we all had each other's babies! ==== Drakefyre: Those are hideous mangos. Posts: 1415 | Registered: Thursday, March 27 2003 08:00 |
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Councilor
Member # 6600
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written Friday, December 29 2006 09:58
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Originally by Nikki: quote:So, just the ones that improve your leadership then? :P Dikiyoba would only use a few, just enough to survive these turbulent times (and get the cool glowing skin) but not enough to lose control. Posts: 4346 | Registered: Friday, December 23 2005 08:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 7764
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written Friday, December 29 2006 10:01
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Same as Dikiyoba here.But I would use only the best canisters (aura of flames,create drakon etc.) -------------------- I have a karma of 2!Yay! Posts: 60 | Registered: Monday, December 11 2006 08:00 |
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Guardian
Member # 5360
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written Friday, December 29 2006 13:55
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It would depend if things were available otherwise. If you could simply learn the spells and creations, then Nalyd would never touch a canister. If not, then screw it! Bring on the Tower of Power! -------------------- May the fires of Undeath burn in your soul, and consume it. Posts: 1636 | Registered: Wednesday, January 5 2005 08:00 |