No Taxes!

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AuthorTopic: No Taxes!
Lifecrafter
Member # 87
Profile Homepage #0
What would life be like without taxes?
The government would print its own money, leading to inflation, basically a tax on all money everywhere. Your thoughts please.

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Tip of the Day: #13 Stand clear the closing door.

That's treason.
(THNIK)(Peculiar James, FP productions co, inc)
Posts: 816 | Registered: Friday, October 5 2001 07:00
Law Bringer
Member # 335
Profile Homepage #1
The devaluing of the currency would either result in a barter economy and the collapse of the government or a revolution in which a more sane government would be put in place.

—Alorael, who would rather have higher taxes, not none at all.
Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00
Guardian
Member # 2080
Profile #2
Taxes pay for stuff in the city to get fixed. Without taxes people would be woken up at 3am because some bridge is down and they'll have to brink their own equipment, thus pissing a lot of people off.
Posts: 1918 | Registered: Sunday, October 13 2002 07:00
Infiltrator
Member # 2669
Profile Homepage #3
This would have been an appropriate topic for April 15th.

See, technically, if the government has no income, it can't (well, shouldn't) print money. There is a pretty long history of the founding fathers being against a central bank with minting powers. In the early to mid-eighteen hundreds, money was printed by individual banks, which, of course, was a mess.

Personally, i don't like taxes (who does), but as long as I see something in return, I'll be happy to pay them. Illegitimate wars and a prison-building boom do not make me a happy taxpayer. Also, the roads around here are deplorable.

If the state has no capital, it'll be hard for it to do anything, unless you either force your citizens to provide services, or rely on volunteers. Neither idea sounds very appealing to me.

But i'm sure you'll hear from the anarchists, who might beg to differ.

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Posts: 647 | Registered: Wednesday, February 19 2003 08:00
Babelicious
Member # 39
Profile Homepage #4
As an anarchist, I beg to differ.

I like paying taxes.

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desperance.net - honestly, no biting.
Posts: 1074 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00
Infiltrator
Member # 2669
Profile Homepage #5
Call me ignorant, but how would taxation work in an anarchic system? It would have to be collected by some sort of central power, wouldn't it, which would be anathema to the whole anarchic idea. Plus, requiring citizens to pay taxes would also smack of power-wielding, especially if the citizens refuse to comply.

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Posts: 647 | Registered: Wednesday, February 19 2003 08:00
Triad Mage Banned Veteran
Member # 165
Profile Homepage #6
What the world should be and what the world has to be to become so are two decisively different pictures, to rudely speak for my associate Mr. Boeh. In an ideal system, there would be no need for taxes.
Of course, in a system by which an ideal system can be reached or reasonably approached, taxes must increase. So there you are.

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desperance -- je me souviens
arena -- et je me souviens de vous
Posts: 2449 | Registered: Monday, October 15 2001 07:00
Lifecrafter
Member # 521
Profile Homepage #7
When I have my way and Mother Brain is our government, she can have the Martian robots do the work, letting humans have a universal man hour instead. ( I am actually serious, I want a direct democracy by computer proxy that will end up in a machine known as Mother Brain.)

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I am not really here.
Posts: 956 | Registered: Wednesday, January 16 2002 08:00
Infiltrator
Member # 2669
Profile Homepage #8
Ikari, you should look up a dusty old RPG called 'Paranoia'. Total bullseye.

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Posts: 647 | Registered: Wednesday, February 19 2003 08:00
Babelicious
Member # 39
Profile Homepage #9
quote:
Originally posted by Ooklah the Moc:
Call me ignorant, but how would taxation work in an anarchic system? It would have to be collected by some sort of central power, wouldn't it, which would be anathema to the whole anarchic idea. Plus, requiring citizens to pay taxes would also smack of power-wielding, especially if the citizens refuse to comply.
Anarchy doesn't mean that people can't work together. The ideal government is one formed by informed agreement between the people of a nation -- the common name for such a government is democracy.
The "arch" in "anarchy" means 'rule', not 'government'. The difference between, say, a paternalistic corporate oligarchy like the United States and an ideal anarchy is that in one, one class rules another (the corporate leaders rule everyone else), and in the other, people rule themselves. Self-governance.
I believe that the best way to achieve the environment in which an enlightened anarchy may be obtained is via the removal of excess power from the hands of those who rule today and redistributing it amongst the people; this is basically done via regulation of industry, improved education, a greater emphasis on democracy, and social welfare for the less fortunate.
To paraphrase Eugene Debs, I do not wish to pull the capitalist down to the worker's level; I wish to pull him up to the honor of being a regular citizen.
The current party that I support as being conducive to the fundamentals of anarchy is the Green Party of the United States.

--

Accursed technologists.

[ Monday, April 28, 2003 14:28: Message edited by: M. Boeh ]
Posts: 1074 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00
Fire! Fire! Fire! Fire!
Member # 919
Profile #10
quote:
Originally posted by Permutonominus Rex:
No Taxes!
Do you want to build your own roads?

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And though the musicians would die, the music would live on in the imaginations of all who heard it.
-The Last Pendragon

TEH CONSPIRACY IZ ALL

Les forum de la chance.

In case of emergency, break glass.
Posts: 3351 | Registered: Saturday, April 6 2002 08:00
Agent
Member # 798
Profile Homepage #11
In a Society like Thomas Mores Uthopia there would be no taxes. But our modern world is by far not Thomas Mores Uthopia. So pay pay pay kids, and when you die you still have to pay To burry your body. So in life we pay and in death we pay, Either way you look at it you loose.

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Look Ma, I'm banned!
Posts: 1046 | Registered: Friday, March 22 2002 08:00
Lifecrafter
Member # 521
Profile Homepage #12
YUOR GHAMMER SUXS.

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I am not really here.
Posts: 956 | Registered: Wednesday, January 16 2002 08:00
Guardian
Member # 2080
Profile #13
Come to think of it, if there were no taxes, none of use would need to use roads. Also I wouldn't be force to go through the oh so idiotic public education system.

Come to think of it technology, while nice at times, is over all a bad thing. However, that won't stop me from using it.

Side note: I wouldn't mind if the technology weren't being used by governments that are run by idiots.

Another Sidenote: There is no such thing as an anarchist in the sense that everyone thinks of.
Posts: 1918 | Registered: Sunday, October 13 2002 07:00
SCORPIUS HAS LEFT THE BUILDING!!!
Member # 314
Profile Homepage #14
quote:
Originally posted by JF:
In a Society like Thomas Mores Uthopia there would be no taxes. But our modern world is by far not Thomas Mores Uthopia. So pay pay pay kids, and when you die you still have to pay To burry your body. So in life we pay and in death we pay, Either way you look at it you loose.
You truly are abysmal.

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Posts: 554 | Registered: Sunday, November 25 2001 08:00
SCORPIUS HAS LEFT THE BUILDING!!!
Member # 314
Profile Homepage #15
lol double post

[ Monday, April 28, 2003 16:28: Message edited by: Vladimir Scorpius ]

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CLICK HERE IF YOU LOVE JESUS

ADoS is like a magical punching bag that swings into your fist even when you're not trying to hit it. -Djur
Posts: 554 | Registered: Sunday, November 25 2001 08:00
Shake Before Using
Member # 75
Profile #16
LF - There are probably people out there who DO want to pull down the government and allow chaos to overwhelm the world. :P
Posts: 3234 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00
Cartographer
Member # 2264
Profile Homepage #17
quote:
Originally posted by M. Boeh:
[QBAnarchy doesn't mean that people can't work together. The ideal government is one formed by informed agreement between the people of a nation -- the common name for such a government is democracy.
The "arch" in "anarchy" means 'rule', not 'government'. The difference between, say, a paternalistic corporate oligarchy like the United States and an ideal anarchy is that in one, one class rules another (the corporate leaders rule everyone else), and in the other, people rule themselves. Self-governance.
QB]
I actually know of a town where that type of government is in effect. And it actually works too. It's worked for them for almost 200 years actually. I'm not sure how it would translate into a country government, but if it works on the town/city level, why don't other towns try it? Other than the fact that federal governments won't let them of course.

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And the Glory of the Light did shine upon him.
And the Peace of the Light did he give men.
Binding nations to him. Making one of many.
Yet the shards of hearts did give wounds.
And what was once did come again
-in fire and in storm
splitting all in twain.
For his peace...
-for his peace...
... was the peace...
... was the peace...
... of the sword.
And the Glory of the Light did shine upon him.

Meane sol Ahelle

Check out my Avernum 3 site. This one is incomplete, but better than the one here which is complete, sort of.
Posts: 926 | Registered: Tuesday, November 19 2002 08:00
Infiltrator
Member # 1823
Profile Homepage #18
Your wouldn't be talking about Christiana would your Rache? Anyhow, there are quite a few towns set up like that, having grown out of hippy colonies, but Christiana is probably by far the most well known.

quote:
Originally posted by Lone Flame:
Come to think of it, if there were no taxes, none of use would need to use roads. Also I wouldn't be force to go through the oh so idiotic public education system.
Explain this to me. Why wouldn't we have to use roads if there were no taxes? People would still have to go to work, go shopping etc. (I use the word "need" here for want of a better word - "effectively demanded" would be a good one). Maybe I'm missing something, but your logic seems screwed up to me.

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Riot Shields
Voodoo Economics
It's just business
Cattle prods
And the IMF

I trust I can rely on your vote
Posts: 530 | Registered: Sunday, September 1 2002 07:00
This Side Towards Enemy
Member # 147
Profile #19
Ikari, there's one major problem with direct democracy by computer. Somebody hacks your system, and your nation is up the proverbial creek without a paddle.

And if there's the technology to make something resistant to hacking, there's the technology to negate the previous technology.
Posts: 1000 | Registered: Thursday, October 11 2001 07:00
Lifecrafter
Member # 521
Profile Homepage #20
Thats why it is an AI.

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I am not really here.
Posts: 956 | Registered: Wednesday, January 16 2002 08:00
Warrior
Member # 126
Profile Homepage #21
An AI, huh?

... hm...

"L- L- Look at you... Hacker. You cannot defeat a perfect, immortal machine..."

Maybe I play too many freaked-out video games...

Or maybe everyone else do not play enough!

::huddles up in a corner, wishing he had an assault rifle, as the monkeys approach::

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Check out the DIARY, why doncha? It won't bite. Probably.

"We were heart companions,
We were companions in the woods,
We were fellows of the same bed,
Where we used to sleep the balmy sleep.
After mortal battles abroad,
In countries many and far distant,
Together we used to practice, and go
Through each forest, learning with Scathach".
Posts: 161 | Registered: Monday, October 8 2001 07:00
Cartographer
Member # 2264
Profile Homepage #22
Actually, the town I'm talking about grew out of the only Native American community in Canada to be given the right of self-government when their original treaty was made. The town itself is actually a reservation, I believe, but since there's more people of other descent living there now and the original premise is still working...

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And the Glory of the Light did shine upon him.
And the Peace of the Light did he give men.
Binding nations to him. Making one of many.
Yet the shards of hearts did give wounds.
And what was once did come again
-in fire and in storm
splitting all in twain.
For his peace...
-for his peace...
... was the peace...
... was the peace...
... of the sword.
And the Glory of the Light did shine upon him.

Meane sol Ahelle

Check out my Avernum 3 site. This one is incomplete, but better than the one here which is complete, sort of.
Posts: 926 | Registered: Tuesday, November 19 2002 08:00
Fire! Fire! Fire! Fire!
Member # 919
Profile #23
Imby: There are, believe me.

Whoever said JF's grammar sux: Whatafool. His grammar was perfect. He misspelled two, maybe three words. And everyone understood exactly what he was saying, because those misspelled words weren't too far from right.

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And though the musicians would die, the music would live on in the imaginations of all who heard it.
-The Last Pendragon

TEH CONSPIRACY IZ ALL

Les forum de la chance.

In case of emergency, break glass.
Posts: 3351 | Registered: Saturday, April 6 2002 08:00
Agent
Member # 1359
Profile #24
quote:
Originally posted by iDavid:
Imby: There are, believe me.
I am acquainted with several.

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Posts: 1277 | Registered: Monday, June 24 2002 07:00

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