8000: Pseudoscience Postravaganza
Pages
| Author | Topic: 8000: Pseudoscience Postravaganza |
|---|---|
|
Shaper
Member # 6292
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 09:53
Profile
[ Wednesday, December 13, 2006 20:21: Message edited by: Synergy67 ] -------------------- A4 Item Locations A4 Singleton G4 Items List G4 Forging List The Insidious Infiltrator Posts: 2009 | Registered: Monday, September 12 2005 07:00 |
|
Law Bringer
Member # 335
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 10:24
Profile
Homepage
That's true for your general practitioner, but cutting-edge (sometimes literally) medical science is very much aware of energy and quantum mechanics. Classical mechanics have their place, such as in analyzing forces at play in muscle and skeletal movements, but biochemistry tends towards chemistry, and chemistry requires quantifiable answers. —Alorael, who just Thuryled. He's quite proud of it, too, although he's a bit sorry that he didn't stoop all that low. Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
|
Shaper
Member # 6292
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 10:44
Profile
[ Wednesday, December 13, 2006 20:21: Message edited by: Synergy67 ] -------------------- A4 Item Locations A4 Singleton G4 Items List G4 Forging List The Insidious Infiltrator Posts: 2009 | Registered: Monday, September 12 2005 07:00 |
|
Skip to My Lou
Member # 40
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 12:42
Profile
Homepage
 -------------------- Take the Personality Test! Deep down, you wish you were a stick figure. Posts: 1629 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00 |
|
Agent
Member # 2759
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 13:47
Profile
Homepage
I don't believe this thread has any purpose other than for Thuryl to show off his big... postcount and knowledge of science, but if it results in more stick figures, then that is welcome. -------------------- "I can't read this thread with that image. But then, that's not a complaint." -Scorpius Geneforge 4 stuff. Also, everything I know about Avernum | Avernum 2 | Avernum 3 | Avernum 4 Posts: 1104 | Registered: Monday, March 10 2003 08:00 |
|
Shaper
Member # 6292
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 13:53
Profile
Hear! Hear! Where ya been hidin', Alex? -S- -------------------- A4 Item Locations A4 Singleton G4 Items List G4 Forging List The Insidious Infiltrator Posts: 2009 | Registered: Monday, September 12 2005 07:00 |
|
Skip to My Lou
Member # 40
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 14:26
Profile
Homepage
I'm lurkalicious. :D -------------------- Take the Personality Test! Deep down, you wish you were a stick figure. Posts: 1629 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00 |
|
Agent
Member # 2820
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 14:32
Profile
That pool cue is positively hilarious. Good job. -------------------- Thuryl: I mean, most of us don't go around consuming our own bodily fluids, no matter how delicious they are. ==== Alorael: War and violence would end if we all had each other's babies! ==== Drakefyre: Those are hideous mangos. Posts: 1415 | Registered: Thursday, March 27 2003 08:00 |
|
Post Navel Trauma ^_^
Member # 67
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 15:35
Profile
Homepage
From my experience of classical physics vs quantum physics, I'd say that the "classical -> particles, quantum -> energy" isn't so much a simplification, or a description of what happens in practice, as it is flat-out wrong. Solving problems using things like conservation of energy, or least action, was originally developed for classical physics and then reapplied to quantum physics once that came round. Thermodynamics preceeds quantum theory too. Then quantum theory comes in and says (among other things) that things we used to treat as forces or energy transmission via waves can also be thought of as being carried by moving particles. (and vice versa). -------------------- Barcoorah: I even did it to a big dorset ram. desperance.net - Don't follow this link Posts: 1798 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00 |
|
Shaper
Member # 6292
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 16:08
Profile
[ Wednesday, December 13, 2006 20:21: Message edited by: Synergy67 ] -------------------- A4 Item Locations A4 Singleton G4 Items List G4 Forging List The Insidious Infiltrator Posts: 2009 | Registered: Monday, September 12 2005 07:00 |
|
Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 16:25
Profile
Homepage
You're not talking about what scientists call "energy." You're talking about what biologists call someone's "mental set." That's totally different, and it has been and continues to be studied. It's just not as effective at, say, curing cancer as medicines are. Moreover, it has nothing whatever to do with quantum mechanics or relativity. [ Tuesday, December 12, 2006 16:34: Message edited by: Kelandon ] -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
|
Shaper
Member # 6292
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 17:31
Profile
[ Wednesday, December 13, 2006 20:22: Message edited by: Synergy67 ] -------------------- A4 Item Locations A4 Singleton G4 Items List G4 Forging List The Insidious Infiltrator Posts: 2009 | Registered: Monday, September 12 2005 07:00 |
|
Law Bringer
Member # 335
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 18:23
Profile
Homepage
You're mixing science and mysticism, Synergy. Pharmaceutical companies stick with drugs. Occasionally they branch out into novel forms of treatment, but drugs are what they do. I'm less familiar with surgery, but I believe it works on the principles of figuring out what needs to be done and then doing it, usually with exhaustive research in advance. If it works, it becomes part of the repertoire. You claim that energy is "100% efficient." On what basis? Energy exists and does things, but it never does 100% what you want. That's basic thermodynamics. Energy is also quite often tied up in the molecules and chemicals you disparage. What fuels our cells? Molecules that store and release energy. The effect of current and electric fields on bodies are studied. The other "energies" you name aren't energy in any scientific sense. Emotion and thought aren't "pooh-poohed" because they seem less quantifiable. We can't quantify them, and we don't even try to quantify them as energy because they aren't. First, discussion of what is physically energy: there is a great deal of research done, but you make it sound much more mystical than it is. Running current through someone isn't (usually) helpful. Phosphorylation of proteins is studied, but it's not based on waves of energy from extrinsic source. We know exactly where our ATP comes from and generally what it does, and yes, our understanding advances with chemistry. Thought, emotion, and other non-scientific energies are studied as well. Take a look at NCCAM for a big example. Promising studies are taken seriously, but most claims are shown to be baseless. The other side of this is, of course, neuroscience and psychology. Nobody denies the valuable and different contributions of these two fields of science. Yes, we know that emotions have an effect on health. There are ways to study it, and it is being studied, without recourse to a rejection of the scientific method or medical science. Take a look at recent advances in biomedical science. In the past few decades we've gone from discovering the structure of DNA to sequencing the whole human genome. DNA chips let us look at protein expression regulation in thousands of genes simultaneously. Proteomics now includes modeling fantastically complicated structures and understanding their function and, yes, where their energy comes from. Bioinformatics lets scientists sift through vast amounts of data. How do all these amount to Dark Ages? For the record, a great deal is known about where cancer comes from. It's usually not diseased immune systems. Genetic predispositions, chemical carcinogens, and even energy in the form of radiation all have their roles. There is plenty of focus on how to prevent or reduce the occurrence of cancer from a purely physical point of view. —Alorael, who would like one serious suggestion of a specific area into which scientific investigation is lacking and could lead to novel new treatments. Claiming that mysticism isn't taken seriously isn't a very strong argument for those who don't take mysticism seriously. Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
|
Shaper
Member # 6292
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 18:51
Profile
[ Wednesday, December 13, 2006 20:22: Message edited by: Synergy67 ] -------------------- A4 Item Locations A4 Singleton G4 Items List G4 Forging List The Insidious Infiltrator Posts: 2009 | Registered: Monday, September 12 2005 07:00 |
|
...b10010b...
Member # 869
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 19:05
Profile
Homepage
Eh. In hindsight, I was lucky to make one of these things without sparking controversy; two was too much to expect. -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
|
Shaper
Member # 6292
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 19:25
Profile
[ Wednesday, December 13, 2006 20:22: Message edited by: Synergy67 ] -------------------- A4 Item Locations A4 Singleton G4 Items List G4 Forging List The Insidious Infiltrator Posts: 2009 | Registered: Monday, September 12 2005 07:00 |
|
Warrior
Member # 5091
|
written Tuesday, December 12 2006 21:36
Profile
The problem isn't your words. It's that what your words are communicating is ludicrous woo of the most limpwristed Choprish sort, altochrister. Posts: 180 | Registered: Friday, October 15 2004 07:00 |
|
...b10010b...
Member # 869
|
written Wednesday, December 13 2006 02:20
Profile
Homepage
Today's name, Plant Perception, is the belief that plants, despite lacking anything resembling a brain or nervous system, have emotions and can read the minds of humans. No, really. Stop giggling. We owe this... remarkable... theory to one Cleve Backster. For reasons best known to himself, he decided to hook up a plant leaf to a polygraph machine. He noticed that some of the patterns recorded on the polygraph looked a little like human anxiety responses, and decided that this must mean he was making his plant nervous. In an attempt to make the plant even more nervous, he searched for a box of matches with which to burn a leaf of the plant. At some point while doing this, he noticed a sharp movement on the polygraph and concluded that the plant was reading his mind. Of course, since there were no controls, he had no way of knowing whether the polygraph would have done that anyway if he hadn't been thinking about burning the plant. -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
|
Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
|
written Wednesday, December 13 2006 08:01
Profile
My plants all have deathwish. -------------------- We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
|
Shaper
Member # 7420
|
written Wednesday, December 13 2006 08:05
Profile
Homepage
How exactly do you hook a plant up to a polygraph? What does it measure? -------------------- You lose. Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00 |
|
Shaper
Member # 3442
|
written Wednesday, December 13 2006 08:07
Profile
Homepage
quote:Is that crunchy-like-a-buffalo-lurkalicious, or cuddleberry-muffin-lurkalicious? -------------------- And when you want to Live How do you start? Where do you go? Who do you need to know? *Name by Slarty, so blame him if it's filthy... Posts: 2864 | Registered: Monday, September 8 2003 07:00 |
|
Law Bringer
Member # 335
|
written Wednesday, December 13 2006 08:18
Profile
Homepage
I can see hooking a plant up to something, but a polygraph measures such signs as heart rate and blood pressure. Plants don't have either one. Maybe it would have to be transpiration rate and, uh, photosynthesis? I suppose surface conductivity remains viable. [Edit: As it turns out, that's basically what he did. Monitoring conductivity due to water movement is a decent plant polygraph, I guess, although ascribing emotions to it seems to be a bit of a leap. Just a bit.] —Alorael, who wonders what people are supposed to eat once the plant rights activists join with the animal-rights vegetarians. Soylent green may be the only food left. [ Wednesday, December 13, 2006 08:23: Message edited by: In Times of Tandem ] Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
|
Shaper
Member # 3442
|
written Wednesday, December 13 2006 08:25
Profile
Homepage
quote:Spam. Or hot-dogs. They have no meat in them at all, and they can't be classed as plants either. They just sorta 'exist' :P -------------------- And when you want to Live How do you start? Where do you go? Who do you need to know? *Name by Slarty, so blame him if it's filthy... Posts: 2864 | Registered: Monday, September 8 2003 07:00 |
|
Lifecrafter
Member # 7538
|
written Wednesday, December 13 2006 15:04
Profile
Homepage
quote:To spam! Actually, though, I'm all for saving a plant and eating a cow. EDIT: Oh! Post 200. Look at that. Too bad I'm too lazy to upload images. [ Wednesday, December 13, 2006 15:07: Message edited by: Nemesis ] -------------------- Do not provoke the turtles. They do not like being provoked. -Lenar My website: Nemesis' Refuge Posts: 743 | Registered: Friday, September 29 2006 07:00 |
|
Councilor
Member # 6600
|
written Wednesday, December 13 2006 15:17
Profile
Homepage
Originally by Nikki: quote:Twinkies! Or more seriously (but only slightly so), stuff that's already dead. We'll become a society of scavengers. There's probably not enough (freshly) dead stuff available to feed everyone in the world, but that won't be a problem once people start starving to death. Dikiyoba. Posts: 4346 | Registered: Friday, December 23 2005 08:00 |