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Episode 4: Spiderweb Reloaded. Something like that anyway. in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #418
I suspect Ephesos would prefer sacred cow to zombie.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Another Old School Game in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #22
quote:
Originally written by Tyranicus:

The original version of Exile on the Mac had music. The later versions do not.
Correction: the original version of Exile did not have music. The original version of Exile II did have music, and when Exile was redone using Exile III style graphics the Bach fugue was added. Exile III never had music, though.

The Exile II music, whatever it was, was spectacularly fitting for the game, and remarkable for its ability to not be annoying even after it looped for the 2000th time.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
OOC: The Vale RP in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #84
Let's give Goldenking some support here. Even in the Avernum RP he did accept feedback on his ridiculous faction, eventually, and bow out. And his posts demonstrate a clear and substantial increase in maturity since then.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #88
Stillness, I think you can answer Dikiyoba's question after all. Surely you have a little bit of imagination!

But perhaps a better question is this one: imagine a world just like ours, in which marriage remains only for a man and a woman. Same sex couples can't be married, but they can be in government-recognized civil unions.

Now suppose that all of the privileges currently tied to marriage -- medical, legal, taxational, etc. -- suppose the government decreed that only same sex civil unions would receive those privileges. Traditional marriages wouldn't.

How would you feel about that? Would that be just? According to the logic you have expressed here, it would be just fine: the same sex couples are receiving something "extra", rather than the heterosexual marriages being denied any privileges.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Episode 4: Spiderweb Reloaded. Something like that anyway. in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #403
I notice there was some speculation about the appearance of Graze Dead and Reincownate, so allow me to clarify a few relevant misconceptions:

The Nine-Headed Cave Cow has four stomachs, not thirty-six. The power of His and Her divine stomachs can be tapped into through the use of a Foal Crystal. The spell of Graze Dead allows the caster to act as a psychopomp, helping a corpse find its way to one of the divine stomachs via the Foal Crystal, to which the corpse becomes spiritually linked until it is released through the use of a Reincownate spell, which resurrects the dead creature as a cow. Creatures that have been restored in this way become the sacred cows, or moocows.

These spells are often confused with Capture Foal and Simuleacrum. Those two spells -- both quite versatile -- are in fact concerned with procreation.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
OOC: The Vale RP in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #63
My Panasse!

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #84
quote:
Originally written by Student of Trinity:

Arguments about civic law and religious doctrine, in western cultures, are like the monkey in Buddha's hand. Run as far as you can, you're still wrapped in its grasp.
This is a rather ominous statement, considering it was recently proved in another thread that Buddha's hand is Cthulhu's head.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
OMG!! in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #26
Some of those little characters were handled nicely in A4, like Tor and Carol. And Anastasia, Vicky, Bevan, Anford, Angarahad, Captain Johnson, Mairwen...

Others weren't, though. A small cadre of Avernites who had travelled to Upper Exile in A3 to get closer to the surface returned to the caves with no explanation or reference whatsoever: not just Elspeth, but also Crisper, Julio, Townsend...

Yong-Mi's betrayal of Avernum to the Darkside Loyalists was particularly bizarre, given her hatred of the Empire and her self-risking heroism on behalf of Avernum.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #76
Yes, that's a good point. Bad Thuryl! Don't troll the Christians, they're high in cholesterol.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #72
So you're in favour of mail-order spouses?

("There's a hole in the bucket, dear Excalibur, dear Excalibur...")

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Avernum Consensus Poll in The Avernum Trilogy
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #4
Aimee was in two games, though the second time her role was quite small.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Avernum Consensus Poll in The Avernum Trilogy
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #1
Pyrn and Thompson, both one-shots, make the mages list, while Elderan, Sixus, and Bojar don't -- to say nothing of important recurring characters like Bon-Ihrno, Enla, or Kelner?

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Best Spiderweb serious EVER in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #25
That's "Vaati."

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #52
quote:
Originally written by Stillness:

Marriage is treated differently. Everyone is equally free to marry.
And again, that isn't the issue. The issue is that the government treats people differently when they are married in several ways that are not, or are not easily, duplicatable by other means. This is the whole point of a domestic partnership type approach: churches are allowed to define the parameters of marriage however they like, preserving that religious freedom, while non-religious privileges traditionally associated with marriage do not depend on those parameters.

quote:
By the way, race is based on arbitrary manmade distinction. Gender is not.
Does that mean we can discriminate against women? Oh, goody.

If that's not what you meant, and I hope not, could you clarify what you are getting at?

quote:
I was just stating the fact that it’s not a protestant thing or even necessarily a religious one.
Well, it's certainly not a religious thing. Historically, I think religion has served as a home for liminal sexuality just as often as it's castigated it. It may not be unique to Protestantism, but isn't it pretty classically Protestant? I mean, what about all those bible verses people are constantly quoting about it?

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
OMG!! in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #20
E1: Cotra.
E2: One in Silvar, one in -- I think -- Formello? They were split up when Cotra was attacked.
E3: New Cotra (in Upper Exile).
A4: Somebody named Elspeth is in rebuilt Cotra.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #48
The problem with freedom, Excalibur, is that one person's freedom is another person's infringement of freedom. If I am free to poke my neighbor with a stick, he can't be free to not be poked by sticks. Making laws is about balancing freedom and lack of freedom so that the most important freedoms are preserved.

In practice, employment discrimination laws have much less impact on positions where many applicants are considered for a single position, where personality, fit with the company and with co-workers, and so on are important considerations. Affirmative action can affect these positions but it is hard for discrimination laws too since reasons for hiring or not hiring can easily be fabricated. The laws mainly affect skilled and unskilled labor jobs with numerous identical positions, jobs where somebody could make blanket statements like "I only want to hire whites" or "I don't want any women in my plant."

Obviously, there are legitimate ways to sort people apart for job-worthiness; in fact most ways are legitimate. That's why there tend to be lists of "protected statuses" such as race and gender that are deemed to be irrelevant to most jobs.

Let me ask you: how would you feel if you were denied a job because you are a Christian?

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #39
quote:
Originally written by Stillness:

...same sex marriage. That wouldn’t effect equality anymore than provisions for marrying trees would.
I realize this quote is out of context, but you have to admit it's a little dehumanizing.

The point is that heterosexual relationships are treated differently from homosexual relationships even if they are otherwise similar. When it comes to religion or your personal life, it would be wrong to deny people the right to treat them differently. Conversely, when it comes to civil rights and legal status, it is wrong for the government to to treat them differently.

This is the same theory that says white power groups, for example, have a right to freedom of expression; but it is not right for the government to treat black couples differently from white couples in any way.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
OOC: The Vale RP in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #16
What's wrong with morbidly obese heroes?

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #30
quote:
Originally written by Jewelz:

The privileges aren't given for no reason, though. The government wants men and women to get married and (here's the key) procreate so that next year's military will have a good population of strapping young lads to fight in their wars and next year's lads will have ladies to birth their next generation. Marriage of one man and one woman increases the chances of this happening and provides for a... hopefully stable foundation for the upbringing of said children. Thus the reason it is encouraged and rewarded with tax relief.
Alorael's point about choice to the side, the goal you mention here -- of increased procreation -- is a spurious one. Overpopulation is going to be an issue for us before underpopulation is. Do you have any idea how overcrowded the foster care system is? Adopt, adopt, adopt! (Adopt the One Child Policy!) While the military obviously needs a lot of strapping young lads and lasses, increased use of technology has been replacing some of the demand for warm bodies for decades.

And if there really were a need for more strapping young folk in arms, perhaps the military would be more receptive to the ladies, and would also stop refusing those men and women who are openly gay.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #29
quote:
Originally written by Stillness:

I think they are. The only thing I can think of is military restrictions on sharing your sexuality, but not on practicing it. But in general, discrimination based on sexuality is illegal here.
The main thing I was thinking of was privileges related to partnership. Not the marriage issue, which is a stupid one IMHO given how easily other countries have solved that with the invention of domestic partnerships; but everything peripheral to that. Legal recognition with regard to, for example, hospital visitation and medical decision-making.

But there are other inequalities perpetuated by the government. The Department of Defense still classifies homosexuality as a mental disorder, 34 years after it was removed from the DSM. That's a bit different from just saying "don't talk about it." (Obviously, it doesn't list heterosexuality as one.)

20 states have laws prohibiting discrimination based on sexual orientation. The other 30 don't. So in 3/5 of the country, such discrimination is legal.

quote:
By the way, a sentiment of anti-homosexuality is far from being the sole property of conservative Protestants. I think it's safe to say it's ubiquitous the world over.
It isn't ubiquitous. It's certainly common to many different peoples and groups, in some form at any rate, but it's far from ubiquitous.

I mentioned conservative Protestantism because that is the major moral matrix opposing homosexuality in this country.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #22
Homosexual acts may not be illegal, but homosexuals and other queer people aren't given all the rights and privileges of straights. So clearly the government does have an opinion on sexuality, and it's one that happens to coincide with a more conservative Protestant opinion.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Omaha Mall Shooting in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #7
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spree_killer

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
OOC: The Vale RP in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #5
Um... it may not be the best idea to equate Jeff Vogel with Creator. You know... for clarity.

Meanwhile... WTF?????

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
OMG!! in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #17
They aren't quite permanently paired. Or at least, A4 has a character named Elspeth in rebuilt Cotra (her old home), but no Nance. And no relevant dialogue either. It's unclear if it's the same Elspeth, but it would be quite a coincidence otherwise. I found that particular point quite disappointing.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Meadows of Heaven in General
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #40
Joy Division has got to be the most influential band to take a new direction -- or at any rate the most name-dropped -- since Kraftwerk.

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Slarty vs. DeskDesk vs. SlartyTimeline of ErmarianG4 Strategy Central
"Making poorly-sourced claims is not the same as determining something."
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00

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