Morality in Avernum

AuthorTopic: Morality in Avernum
Apprentice
Member # 3203
Profile Homepage #0
What do you think about stealing and stuff like that. I don't mean to antagonize anyone or anything, I just want to know if you like to play the upright pious heroes or the sneaky anything-to-get-more-powerful-or-richer adventurers. Also, how do you feel about using the unlimited item resellers? I just figure selling to one of them means teaching them how to make something. If you're intentionally a low-life you could even be in partnership with one of them to, say, make copies of research books (or records, whatever it was) that the guy in the Portal Station wants. The unlimited item reseller makes them, you give them to the guy, you both turn a profit! What do you guys do, or do you not get this far into your character's ethics?

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I am Corrigan, upon my shoulders rests the burden of the wizards, mages, enchanters, and magi. My sword is the greatest of fears of the enemies of peace and the enemies of right. Woe unto those who challenge me magically, for their lives will be short and unfruitful. My failures hurt me more than all the others, but my triumphs can be felt by all. I am leader, king, and companion. Let all those who wish to succeed follow and come with me.
Posts: 3 | Registered: Thursday, July 10 2003 07:00
Lifecrafter
Member # 4682
Profile #1
It depends what mood I'm in. If I'm really bored and/or angry, I steal people's stuff and then go and kill off the town.

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Do not underestimate the power of the mechanical pencil.

Join the Dark side. We have cookies.

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Bye Bye Birdie

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Posts: 834 | Registered: Thursday, July 8 2004 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 1852
Profile #2
I'm more of a do-anything-to-get-ahead, power-hungry-adventurer myself, though I dont like using the unlimited item resellers, it's too cheesy.
Posts: 45 | Registered: Sunday, September 8 2002 07:00
Warrior
Member # 4654
Profile #3
there is a very special system of morals i avernum. it depends on your mood. attimes i dont feel like even lettin the people who help me live . and at times i feel a love towards all avernite beings.

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life is too short to be taken seriously.hmm.but its also the longest thing a person can ever do!
Posts: 78 | Registered: Friday, July 2 2004 07:00
Shock Trooper
Member # 60
Profile #4
I will steal anything I can, if it's worth quite a bit. Occasionally, I'll steal and make the town mad, go to the editor, and reset the town. But only two or three times have I done this. The only friendly town I've cleared out was Spire in A1 - those bandits, thieves, and that <insert derogatory term that I'm not sure I'm allowed to post here> they had for a mayor deserved to die. :mad:

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"Insanity is okay, but stupidity is inexcusable." -Kenda Nicole Brand

Jacob say, "Man who smoke pot, choke on handle." -Jacob Doran
Posts: 202 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 4761
Profile Homepage #5
quote:
Originally written by PantherShadow:

I will steal anything I can, if it's worth quite a bit. Occasionally, I'll steal and make the town mad, go to the editor, and reset the town. But only two or three times have I done this. The only friendly town I've cleared out was Spire in A1 - those bandits, thieves, and that <insert derogatory term that I'm not sure I'm allowed to post here> they had for a mayor deserved to die. :mad:
Yep, a bloody mess that was, I remember the genocide and enjoyed every minute of it.

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"I don't want to achieve immortality through my work, I want to achieve it through not dying."
Posts: 30 | Registered: Thursday, July 22 2004 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 3191
Profile #6
Oh that.

Well in general it goes like this:

1)If the person/town in question is particularly nice to me, no I dont steal.

2)If I will get caught, I dont steal.

3)If the person/town in question is neither nice nor rude towards me, I *probably* wont steal from them, especially if its a small pittance.

4)If the person/town in question is particularly rude towards me, even those possesions that are bolted down and nailed into the ground arnt safe.

5) If the item in question is particularly good/has significant novelty value, I'm almost certainly going to steal it except where condition 1 applies, and at times condition 2.

6) If I'm running through a scenario I have already played, I drop all pretense at role-playing and have no compunction at stealing at all. This last condition overrides the previous 5, although in this case I'm usually more interested in getting a specific thing done in the scenario and hence fly through it, so most people probably wont get stolen from anyway.

[ Thursday, August 26, 2004 04:56: Message edited by: Sasuke ]
Posts: 22 | Registered: Tuesday, July 8 2003 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 4162
Profile Homepage #7
Good question. If Im working with a good character/team then stealing by default is prohibited. Unless the story, conditions warrant it. In ad@d Im typically neutral good alignment, which tends to carry over to just about any rpg.

If my character/group happens to be evil, well it all depends. Often items available for stealing particularly at the start or early levels of the game are transparent options for power gamers. As such while their may be no ethical quandries for this course of action, extraneous considerations (e.g. challenge) may inhibit these activities.
Posts: 36 | Registered: Sunday, March 28 2004 08:00
Agent
Member # 3349
Profile Homepage #8
I'll make a party, save it as "Evil Party1" or "Good Party6" or so on. If I was using the Evil Party I'd kill everything that moved and plunder towns. If I was playing as good party I'd do the side quests, blah, blah, blah...

But that dosen't mean an occasional merchant gets smited by my good party...

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And everybody say....Yatta!
Posts: 1287 | Registered: Thursday, August 14 2003 07:00
Shock Trooper
Member # 303
Profile #9
I'm just here for the good of all Avernum. The good people should be left alone and the demons, Nephilim, Slithzerikai, and bandits should be killed. :cool:

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My name's Solberg. Pronounced Sol-Berg. Exile/Avernum's Greatest LIVING Archmage! I'm sure you've heard of me at some point.
Posts: 385 | Registered: Tuesday, November 20 2001 08:00
Shock Trooper
Member # 2123
Profile #10
I just kill the dogs and cats in any town. Then I try to get out of town with out killing anyone else.

~I like the sound the dogs make when they die.

~~I feel so evil.
Posts: 228 | Registered: Monday, October 21 2002 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 4902
Profile #11
Eh, I kind of go by the old adage...

It ain't a crime if you don't get caught.

You can get some NICE starting gear (especially in Avernum 3) if you check your morals in at the door and rob the townsfolk blind, and that includes pushing crates/barrels into secure, windowless rooms and taking the goodies within.

I always wonder why the guards don't get suspicious:

Soldier Bob:
"Hey, Frank, those 4 Adventurers and pushing crates out of So-and-So's shop into that old, windowless, abondoned building."

Soldier Frank:
"Yep. But I'm sure they have the best of intentions. Let's just keep on standing here, since we can safely assume such honorable folks would never steal from our poor, beleagured town."

Yeah, it cracks me up. I do stop raiding towns after a while, though. I mean, when you're playing Avernum 2, and you're Level 48 with all Blessed armor and Elemental Weapons, etc, etc, is it REALLY worth searching every dresser in Blosk for goodies? Not really.

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Your training was extensive...
"This... is a tree!"
"...what's it for?"
...and confusing.
---Avernum 3 Intro
Posts: 42 | Registered: Thursday, August 26 2004 07:00
Warrior
Member # 4938
Profile #12
Interesting. I'm an A3 newbie, who decides about morality, depending on whether there's anything worth pinching!i.e. amoral.

This slaughter thing raises a question for me: I thought if you attacked, e.g. guards, the whole place turned out against you and you couldn't hope to win. Is that not so? (Suppose I should save a game and try it. :D )

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"Keep both hands where I can see them"
Posts: 52 | Registered: Monday, September 6 2004 07:00
Law Bringer
Member # 335
Profile Homepage #13
The whole place turns against you, and guards are tough, but they're not unbeatable. In fact, in A2, you have to kill several of them. But for low-level parties, wiping out towns is impossible. Confine your pernicious deeds to areas where nobody can see them.

—Alorael, who has given the matter of guards some thought. Since they are much stronger than ordinary soldiers, there must be a reason. It's obvious: magical steroids! Sure, they're tough, hulking brutes, but they were unfortunately cerebrectomized in the process. Such is the price of defending the homeland.
Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00
Shock Trooper
Member # 2123
Profile #14
quote:
Originally written by Fear and Loathing:

The whole place turns against you, and guards are tough, but they're not unbeatable.
The first time I fought with guards I they killed me really fast. After that it was no longer all about saving the world, only getting strong so I could have my revenge.
Posts: 228 | Registered: Monday, October 21 2002 07:00
Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
Profile Homepage #15
quote:
Originally written by Solberg the All-Powerful:
The good people should be left alone and the demons, Nephilim, Slithzerikai, and bandits should be killed.
Remember before your genocide that not all nephils or sliths are evil. Those of Gnass struggle with this misperception every day.

I would wager a guess that not all demons are completely evil either, although there has been no evidence of that in the games. Hrm. Sounds like a good BoA scenario premise. And, of course, the definition of "bandit" is competely subjective; are the rebels of ASR bandits or freedom fighters?

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Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens.
Smoo: Get ready to face the walls!
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Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00
Infiltrator
Member # 4256
Profile #16
Thank you for the defense of the Kitties and Sliths. I feel distinctly offended at the commander in Fort Duvno A2 when he insults sliths to your face. Umm- "good demons" isn't that slightly oxymoronic? There seem to be demons that just don't care but as for good it seems difficult. Would they be angelic beings? Seeing as demons/angels tend to be the flipsides of the coin of good and evil that would make sense... but it just doesn't seem to be in the spiritual order of Ermarian. But then again there's always room for something new. :)

[ Monday, September 06, 2004 15:26: Message edited by: macrsp ]

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"Let's just say that if complete and utter chaos was lightning, he'd be the sort to stand on a hilltop in a thunderstorm wearing wet copper armour and shouting 'All gods are false'."
Posts: 564 | Registered: Wednesday, April 14 2004 07:00
...b10010b...
Member # 869
Profile Homepage #17
quote:
Originally written by Kelandon:

I would wager a guess that not all demons are completely evil either, although there has been no evidence of that in the games. Hrm. Sounds like a good BoA scenario premise.
Well, there is evidence of demons fighting among one another (one in Exile 1 (and therefore probably Avernum 1 too) was imprisoned by Grah-Hoth and helps the party if freed). So if they're all evil, they're at least evil in different ways and to varying degrees.

Khoth's BoE scenario "Demon" explores the premise you suggest as well.

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The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure!
Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00