I need your help!

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AuthorTopic: I need your help!
Apprentice
Member # 5283
Profile Homepage #0
EDIT: Deleted.

[ Sunday, June 18, 2006 15:58: Message edited by: jockmo42 ]
Posts: 17 | Registered: Saturday, December 11 2004 08:00
Lifecrafter
Member # 6700
Profile Homepage #1
Advice from a guy with experience:

Don't.
Even.
Try.

Not yet, anyway.

Such an endeavor requires experience, loads of preplanning, and a lot of time.
And those with experience enough to bring this to fruition are off building scenarios of their own, so it would be very difficult to get help without getting involved in a massive recruitment campaign.

More advice from a guy with experience:

Start small.
Give us a good, short scenario.
Learn how long it takes to get things done.
Play around a little with the power of scripting. It is more involved and more powerful than you probably gess at this point.
Get involved in the online community. The people here are brilliant resources.

Once you've gotten your good small scenario out, do another, sliightly larger scenario.
Same rules apply.

Once that one gets met with great cheers and approval, then, maybe, you may want to consider recruiting authors for this (I want to say "grand endeavor", but the encyclopedia ermariana already has that title)... ultimus opus.

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The Silent Assassin's pet project is a scenario that was once in concept similar to yours. He downsized quite a bit when he learned the difficulty of scripting, the market for such scenarios, and the limit to how many custom terrains he can have.

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-Lenar Labs
What's Your Destiny?

Ushmushmeifa: Lenar's power is almighty and ineffable.

All hail lord Noric, god of... well, something important, I'm sure.
Posts: 735 | Registered: Monday, January 16 2006 08:00
Law Bringer
Member # 4153
Profile Homepage #2
Thankfully, I realized that Lenar said most of what I wanted to say. So, in short: don't try it, 'cause it won't work. As a designer, I know.

By the way, it sounds like you have no idea what you're doing, so a small scenario would be a very good way to gain some much-needed experience. It's fairly difficult for a one-post newbie to walk in here and rally the community to work on a single project, particularly when said newbie expects to be in charge.

More on the theme of "you don't know what you're doing": If you're going to come to us and try to get us to work on your project, you should have an idea. A plot. A theme. A vague story arc. Something. Because if you don't, anyone who does come to you with ideas will have them scattered across such a broad spectrum that you won't be able to do anything with them all. I noticed that on your website, you don't even know what the main quest will be.

You know, you kind of sound like Will Wright. Just without the creativity and ingenuity.

[ Thursday, June 15, 2006 13:18: Message edited by: Ephesos ]

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Gamble with Gaea, and she eats your dice.

I hate undead. I really, really, really, really hate undead. With a passion.
Posts: 4130 | Registered: Friday, March 26 2004 08:00
Apprentice
Member # 5283
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[ Sunday, June 18, 2006 15:59: Message edited by: jockmo42 ]

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Umm...
Posts: 17 | Registered: Saturday, December 11 2004 08:00
Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
Profile Homepage #4
Designer FAQ, Q3.

EDIT: For the record, if it's in the Designer FAQ, that means it's been asked often enough that I got sick of retyping my answer every time someone brought up the same idea. You are not at all the first to have an idea like this, but you would be the first to finish it.

Direct link to Jeff Vogel's thoughts on the matter.

[ Thursday, June 15, 2006 15:55: Message edited by: Kelandon ]

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Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens.
Smoo: Get ready to face the walls!
Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr.

Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me
The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever
Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00
Guardian
Member # 6670
Profile Homepage #5
I've been working on my debut scenario since February. It has one outdoor section and five towns. And I'm still not done. Granted, work has eaten away most of my day, and I always sacrifice designing in favour of a social life, and I don't think I've worked on it for more than an hour at a time, but still...

The bottom line: if you don't eat, drink, breath, excrete, and dream about BoA, don't start big. If you still want to make your grand epic, I'd recommend making a small prelude first.

One important thing I'd like to point out is that your idea for a community effort works for small scenarios too. Out of ideas for a plot? Ask for advice. Need a script for your big baddie? Start a topic, detail the specs, and watch the help come pouring in (Yes, pouring in. The BoAEd forum is a lonely place.).

Anyway, good luck. Give me a shout if you need a script made; I was disappointed when I found out that my scenario only needed three complicated scripts.

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IF I EVER BECOME AN EVIL OVERLORD:
My doomsday machine will have a highly-advanced technological device called a capacitor in case someone inconveniently pulls the plug at the last second. (If I have access to REALLY advanced technology, I will include a back-up device known as a battery.)
Posts: 1509 | Registered: Tuesday, January 10 2006 08:00
Apprentice
Member # 5283
Profile Homepage #6
EDIT: Deleted.

[ Sunday, June 18, 2006 15:59: Message edited by: jockmo42 ]

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Umm...
Posts: 17 | Registered: Saturday, December 11 2004 08:00
BANNED
Member # 4
Profile Homepage #7
Make something small first just so you know what you're getting into. If you make a scenario with 1 friendly town, 1 dungeon with 2-3 levels and maybe 1 sidequest, you'll know how much work you'll need to do if you want to make a scenario ten times as big.

(PS- criticism)

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Posts: 6936 | Registered: Tuesday, September 18 2001 07:00
Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
Profile Homepage #8
Designer FAQ, Q4. You may have to reload to see the most recent update.

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Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens.
Smoo: Get ready to face the walls!
Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr.

Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me
The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever
Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00
Apprentice
Member # 5283
Profile Homepage #9
EDIT: Deleted.

[ Sunday, June 18, 2006 16:00: Message edited by: jockmo42 ]

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Umm...
Posts: 17 | Registered: Saturday, December 11 2004 08:00
Master
Member # 5977
Profile Homepage #10
No, you don't know what you are getting in too. it took me half a year only to finish designing my own scenario (9 outdoor sections, 44 towns), and then it took me another few months to script and test. And I'm still not done!

A year has past by now, and its not finished. Its getting there slowly, yes, but I can't imagine that you will continue with your project after you really realized what its magnitude is. it will end up dead, trust me.

The only thing that kept me going, were the fact that almost no BoA scenarios were designed, and that I I didn't want to let the work that cost me already a few months of work, to die.

Please, please, listen to what everybody is saying! It sounds asif your scenario will be almost three times as my scenario, and with your experience it will probably take you three years to complete, if not more. Think of it! is it worse the trouble?

Besides, people of the BoA community will probably also not appreciate it that much.

EDIT: I just realized that its not only these two things which kept me going. It was also th fact that I have a rather strong will with these things: If I start with something, I must finish it at all costs. Do realize that I had to work in my holidays every day on it, for a very long time every day. Don't let that happen to you.

[ Thursday, June 15, 2006 22:26: Message edited by: Mc 'mini' Thralni ]

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Play and rate my scenarios:

Where the rivers meet
View my upcoming scenario: The Nephil Search: Escape.

Give us your drek!
Posts: 3029 | Registered: Saturday, June 18 2005 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 5283
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EDIT: Deleted.

[ Sunday, June 18, 2006 16:00: Message edited by: jockmo42 ]

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Umm...
Posts: 17 | Registered: Saturday, December 11 2004 08:00
Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
Profile Homepage #12
We're not trying to help you quit. You've started a project that you're already going to quit, so you need no encouragement there. We're trying to help you do something that you won't quit.

In any case, take the third paragraph of Q4 seriously: go ahead and start your beginner epic. Just be prepared to stop and make a completely different (and smaller) scenario once you've gotten partway in.

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Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens.
Smoo: Get ready to face the walls!
Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr.

Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me
The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever
Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00
Infiltrator
Member # 3441
Profile Homepage #13
quote:
You are not at all the first to have an idea like this, but you would be the first to finish it.

Shyguy

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"As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of darkness surrounding it." --Albert Einstein
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Posts: 536 | Registered: Sunday, September 7 2003 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 5283
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EDIT: Deleted.

[ Sunday, June 18, 2006 16:01: Message edited by: jockmo42 ]

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Umm...
Posts: 17 | Registered: Saturday, December 11 2004 08:00
Warrior
Member # 7223
Profile Homepage #15
As a person with very little experience in the editor:

Don't do it. I tried a massive scenario the first time with the editor. One-tenth through, I quit, and made a much smaller scenario with the same concept.

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Polaris

The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. We live on a placid island of ignorance in the midst of black seas of infinity, and it was not meant that we should voyage far.
- H.P. Lovecraft
Posts: 164 | Registered: Wednesday, June 14 2006 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 5283
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EDIT: Deleted.

[ Sunday, June 18, 2006 16:01: Message edited by: jockmo42 ]

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Umm...
Posts: 17 | Registered: Saturday, December 11 2004 08:00
Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
Profile Homepage #17
quote:
Originally written by jockmo42:

Why are you people so persistent?
You've given every impression that you haven't understood what I've been saying, since I'm not actually saying that it's a bad idea. That's why I keep repeating myself.

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Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens.
Smoo: Get ready to face the walls!
Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr.

Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me
The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever
Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00
Lifecrafter
Member # 6193
Profile Homepage #18
I don't understand why you think everyone is trying to dissuade you from doing this. A project the size you are talking about would take months for even the most experienced designer. People aren't saying "You're a loser, don't try" they're saying "Make a small scenario, use the experience you gain to build your epic." I think Kelandon already suggested making a small scenario related to your epic. Have an idea for one sidequest? Turn it into a samll 5 town scenario and release it for everyone to enjoy. If when you're done with the small scenario you resolve to go on to the epic, then do so, but if you decide its to much work then at least you'll have a finished and playable product. Nothing plagues the blades community like unfinished scenarios, get something done and learn what it takes to build your huge scenario, then build Avernum 3.5
So whichever way you go, you can find scripting help, plot help or whatever you need posting on these boards. Although most experienced designers are loathe to make a formal committment to collaborate on another's project, most would help with a specific question.
-Good luck-

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Guaranteed to blow your mind.

Frostbite: Get It While It's...... Hot?
Posts: 900 | Registered: Monday, August 8 2005 07:00
Babelicious
Member # 39
Profile Homepage #19
With a community like this, I can't imagine why BoA has such a vanishingly small number of scenarios.

Good work, boys.

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Pygmalion | Desperance | Djur
Posts: 1074 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00
BANNED
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Profile Homepage #20
quote:
Originally written by jockmo42:

Have a nice day everyone, I have work to do.
This is a good attitude to have. If you say you have experience in Blades (particularly the more technical aspects), learning to adapt to BoA shouldn't be TOO difficult.

One thing that helped me was to work on a "test scenario"-- that is, a scenario where all I do is test scripts. BoA has oddd quirks, and it's good to get used to them before you get started.

EDIT: Oh, and PS- While it's poor form to audition for artists or scripters, people here are usually quite good about helping you with scripting problems or requests for specific graphics you'd need.

[ Friday, June 16, 2006 11:57: Message edited by: Real Ultimate Designing Power ]

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Posts: 6936 | Registered: Tuesday, September 18 2001 07:00
Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
Profile Homepage #21
quote:
Originally written by Andrea:

BoA has such a vanishingly small number of scenarios
It has more than Pyg. :P

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Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens.
Smoo: Get ready to face the walls!
Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr.

Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me
The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever
Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00
Babelicious
Member # 39
Profile Homepage #22
quote:
Originally written by Kelandon:

quote:
Originally written by Andrea:

BoA has such a vanishingly small number of scenarios
It has more than Pyg. :P

Ha ha. My sides are sure quaking over that one.

I don't see you helping.

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Pygmalion | Desperance | Djur
Posts: 1074 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00
BANNED
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Profile Homepage #23
I mean, if you want to make a passable scenario once in a while, maybe we'd be more generous with you.

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Posts: 6936 | Registered: Tuesday, September 18 2001 07:00
Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
Profile Homepage #24
Djur and TM aside, it has come to my attention that what I was trying to say may not have come across well. All I've really been trying to say this whole time is that it's very hard to make a large scenario, and if it turns out that this thing doesn't work, it'd be better that you give up on the scenario and try something smaller than that you give up on Blades entirely.

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Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens.
Smoo: Get ready to face the walls!
Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr.

Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me
The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever
Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00

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