Civil Unions disallowed in ACT
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Monday, June 26 2006 06:38
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I have to admit that I have absolutely no idea what Meeshka has said this whole time. I read it, but it didn't make any sense. But yes, he is to be commended for his good attitude, if not his clarity. :P EDIT: A "loon" is a lunatic. A crazy person. [ Monday, June 26, 2006 06:42: Message edited by: Kelandon ] -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 4153
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written Monday, June 26 2006 08:15
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quote:Same here... it's difficult to read an argument when you only know what one side is saying. What is "detalisation," just out of curiosity? -------------------- Gamble with Gaea, and she eats your dice. I hate undead. I really, really, really, really hate undead. With a passion. Posts: 4130 | Registered: Friday, March 26 2004 08:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Monday, June 26 2006 09:45
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quote:= "in detail" Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 6908
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written Monday, June 26 2006 09:46
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quote:Well, seems like I was too tired to make it way clear what I tried to say. And now I'm even more tired to untie this nodo gordian. May be tomorrow when I'm fresh I'll give it a try. On a second thought - no. I won't. Since I was called a loon, and in North Woodland tribes it was considered to be an animal of many folklore tales due to its unique appearance and mysterious call, I'd like to stay this way mysterious. Think of those posts as of some practice before a speech on tomorrows conference. Since it failed, I know now, that I have to find better way of thinking. :) quote:Thanks. :) quote:So it was true!? How on earth did he find that out!? I'll have to check my security channel. :D -------------------- 9 masks sing in a choir: Gnome Dwarf Slith Giant Troll Troglo Human Nephil Vahnatai "If the mask under mask to SE of mask to the left of mask and to the right of me is the mask below the mask to the right of mask to the right of mask below me is the same, then who am I?" radix: +2 nicothodes: +1 salmon:+1 Posts: 203 | Registered: Tuesday, March 14 2006 08:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Monday, June 26 2006 09:52
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Meeshka, you said: "If you don't pay attention to your neighbour now, it will be too late when he sneaks upon your dog's crap suddenly one day, so you won't be able to clear it yourself. So you will be accused of, firstly, for not clearing after your dog, and secondly, for intoxicating your neighbour if something happens to him. Did I answer your question?" Using this analogy, you imply that legalization of gay marriage will create an undesirable externality for everyone else. I merely am asking you: what logical negative externalities can you think of that could come from the legalization of gay marriage? Because essentially, you are saying "we shouldn't be so quick to allow X, because X could be bad even though I posit no reason why," and that assertion carries no water. [ Monday, June 26, 2006 09:57: Message edited by: Drew ] Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 6908
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written Monday, June 26 2006 10:08
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quote:Why do you continue to think I see something bad in the legalisation? With my analogy I'm saying that: legalization of gay marriage is to be studied from social point of view, so to say to find the advantages and disadvantages which will be brought by the new couples to the society we live in. They should be legalized since there are people who want that. But since we have NO HISTORICAL BACKGROUND to this threads in society, and I am not a full itme social or political observer, I shall not give any sort of conclusion whether it is bad or not. Imagine... OK, nothing. Just crazy thoughts of historical examples of mistakes of our so to say civilization. :( quote:No. I never said anything like that. May be saying "sneak up upon your dog's crap" was that horrifying? :) BTW, have you ever been to gay-bars or lesbian bars? Although I've seen many quarrels in common bars, I've never seen somebody even talk too loud in those places. They are much more peacefull then hetero ones. :) Edit: TYPO ------------------------------------- The voices tell me they did like the show in one gay bar. I try to dissuade them from going to any bar in nearest future. :P [ Monday, June 26, 2006 10:15: Message edited by: Meeshka ] -------------------- 9 masks sing in a choir: Gnome Dwarf Slith Giant Troll Troglo Human Nephil Vahnatai "If the mask under mask to SE of mask to the left of mask and to the right of me is the mask below the mask to the right of mask to the right of mask below me is the same, then who am I?" radix: +2 nicothodes: +1 salmon:+1 Posts: 203 | Registered: Tuesday, March 14 2006 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Monday, June 26 2006 10:16
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Here's another way of putting what Drew's been saying. You said, if you don't pay attention to your neighbor now, bad things will happen (he'll eat your dog's crap, you'll get accused of bad stuff, etc.). The metaphor was that "paying attention to your neighbor" was "opposing gay marriage" — that was the metaphor that was put forward. So you said, "If you don't oppose gay marriage, bad things will happen." That's why it sounded as though you were opposing gay marriage on questionable grounds. My strong suspicion is that you were attacking the metaphorical side of the argument without any regard to the fact that it was simply a metaphor. [ Monday, June 26, 2006 10:19: Message edited by: Kelandon ] -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 2759
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written Monday, June 26 2006 10:36
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Is this debate still going on? In the UK it's all done and dusted... Edit: As background, as most are probably not aware, in 2004 the UK government legislated to create civil partnership (which is equivalent to marriage in almost every detail). The move was spectacularly uncontroversial, it sailed through Parliament with cross-party support and virtually no opposition (even the right wing nutters only tried to amend it by tagging extra stuff on). Elton John got 'married' to his partner last autumn. Edit 2: The most amusing bit was Queen Elizabeth II announcing the measure in the State Opening of Parliament. [ Monday, June 26, 2006 10:48: Message edited by: Micawber ] -------------------- "I can't read this thread with that image. But then, that's not a complaint." -Scorpius Geneforge 4 stuff. Also, everything I know about Avernum | Avernum 2 | Avernum 3 | Avernum 4 Posts: 1104 | Registered: Monday, March 10 2003 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 3040
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written Monday, June 26 2006 11:21
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quote:What about allowing interracial marriages in the US? It seems to me, at first glance, that there is a similarity between that and allowing same-sex marriages; looking at the circumstances surrounding interracial marriages might provide some context to the issue of same-sex marriage. I don't know much about the legalization of interracial marriages in the US, though, so I will point out that the context exists and leave it to Meeshka to analyze, rather than actually provide the comparison. -------------------- 5.0.1.0.0.0.0.1.0... Posts: 508 | Registered: Thursday, May 29 2003 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Monday, June 26 2006 13:13
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I think maybe Meeksha is responding to a perceived lack of interest in Australian politics. The crap-eating neighbor isn't a reference to gay marriage specifically, it's a reference to why you need to pay attention to what's going on in the world. Or so I posit, since that's the only way I can reconcile dog crap, neighbors, and not opposing gay marriage. —Alorael, who has a strong suspicion that something is getting lost in translation. (From Italian? "Nodo" suggests so.) Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 6908
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written Monday, June 26 2006 20:58
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quote:I think Alo is right with some translation being lost. May be I misused "to pay attention". I thought it was somehow similar with "to look at" or "to listen carefully". But not with "to oppose". :) Edit: "Nodo Gordian" is from interlingua. I'm Russian, you know. [ Monday, June 26, 2006 21:01: Message edited by: Meeshka ] -------------------- 9 masks sing in a choir: Gnome Dwarf Slith Giant Troll Troglo Human Nephil Vahnatai "If the mask under mask to SE of mask to the left of mask and to the right of me is the mask below the mask to the right of mask to the right of mask below me is the same, then who am I?" radix: +2 nicothodes: +1 salmon:+1 Posts: 203 | Registered: Tuesday, March 14 2006 08:00 |
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E Equals MC What!!!!
Member # 5491
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written Monday, June 26 2006 22:03
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quote:You were correct. It appears that there is no language barrier after all, just a doesn't-understand-the-analogy barrier. -------------------- SupaNik: Aran, you're not big enough to threaten Ash. Dammit, even JV had to think twice. Posts: 1861 | Registered: Friday, February 11 2005 08:00 |
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? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
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written Monday, June 26 2006 22:07
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quote:I should apologise for the analogy. It was mine, and it should never have been released into the wild. My neighbor has been quarantined for suspicion of un-American activities and his dogs removed to a foster care situation. Again, no dog crap was harmed in the execution of this analogy. -------------------- quote: Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |
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La Canaliste
Member # 5563
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written Monday, June 26 2006 23:39
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 A loon is also a sea bird, apparently the state bird of Minnesota. And I still like Meeshka's attitude. -------------------- I am a mater of time and how . Deep down, you know you should have voted for Alcritas! Posts: 387 | Registered: Tuesday, March 1 2005 08:00 |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Tuesday, June 27 2006 00:04
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Yup. Anyone who doesn't react after being called a loon three times is my kind of loon. -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Tuesday, June 27 2006 06:32
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quote:It was a metaphor. Salmon created an analogy in which paying attention to whether your neighbor eats dog crap or not was equivalent to opposing gay marriage. They're obviously not literally the same thing. -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 6908
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written Tuesday, June 27 2006 10:41
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Edit: Don't mind, some murmuring about a loonarmy from Thuryl's loon file. Just nothing interesting. Kel, seems like a metaphor is something really personal and shouldn't be used except for the cases of direct and clear analogy, otherwise misunderstandings are unavoidable. I learned that lesson. :) ----------------------------- The voices disagree to join a loonarmy. However, there is also a word "must" besides of "agree". [ Tuesday, June 27, 2006 10:47: Message edited by: Meeshka ] -------------------- 9 masks sing in a choir: Gnome Dwarf Slith Giant Troll Troglo Human Nephil Vahnatai "If the mask under mask to SE of mask to the left of mask and to the right of me is the mask below the mask to the right of mask to the right of mask below me is the same, then who am I?" radix: +2 nicothodes: +1 salmon:+1 Posts: 203 | Registered: Tuesday, March 14 2006 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Tuesday, June 27 2006 14:32
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Don't wave your metaphors at people in public? —Alorael, who can see how this is a metaphor for a lot of those so-called life lessons. Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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Lifecrafter
Member # 59
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written Tuesday, June 27 2006 23:25
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Found this on the 'net, author unknown: 1) Being gay is not natural. Real Americans always reject unnatural things like eyeglasses, polyester, and air conditioning. 2) Gay marriage will encourage people to be gay, in the same way that hanging around tall people will make you tall. 3) Legalizing gay marriage will open the door to all kinds of crazy behaviour. People may even wish to marry their pets because a dog has legal standing and can sign a marriage contract. 4) Straight marriage has been around a long time and hasn't changed at all; women are still property, blacks still can't marry whites, and divorce is still illegal. 5) Straight marriage will be less meaningful if gay marriage were allowed; the sanctity of Brittany Spears' 55-hour just-for-fun marriage would be destroyed. 6) Straight marriages are valid because they produce children. Gay couples, infertile couples, and old people shouldn't be allowed to marry because our orphanages aren't full yet, and the world needs more children. 7) Obviously gay parents will raise gay children, since straight parents only raise straight children. 8) Gay marriage is not supported by religion. In a theocracy like ours, the values of one religion are imposed on the entire country. That's why we have only one religion in America. 9) Children can never succeed without a male and a female role model at home. That's why we as a society expressly forbid single parents to raise children. 10) Gay marriage will change the foundation of society; we could never adapt to new social norms. Just like we haven't adapted to cars, the service-sector economy, or longer life spans. Posts: 950 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00 |
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E Equals MC What!!!!
Member # 5491
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written Wednesday, June 28 2006 00:22
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Breaking in again, the interview with Gary Humphries is done, if anyone's interested. It's 25 minutes long, so it's a big file. -------------------- SupaNik: Aran, you're not big enough to threaten Ash. Dammit, even JV had to think twice. Posts: 1861 | Registered: Friday, February 11 2005 08:00 |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Wednesday, June 28 2006 01:06
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Be warned that I will mentally picture him as Barry Humphries and encourage everyone else to do the same. -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 1092
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written Wednesday, June 28 2006 02:08
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By the way, the reason the Churches aren't to happy towards homosexualti is probably because there is a Commandment that says "Thou shall not commit adultery." -------------------- When you think you can't get any lower in life and hit rock bottom, God hands you a shovel. Why should I say somthin intelligent when idiots like you make me look intelligent in the first place. Posts: 615 | Registered: Friday, May 3 2002 07:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Wednesday, June 28 2006 04:06
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Um, not really. Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |
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? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
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written Wednesday, June 28 2006 06:31
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Does the church prefer adultery over pederasty? Ahh how the moral compass swings. -------------------- quote: Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 6652
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written Thursday, June 29 2006 11:08
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quote:And homosexuality is adultery because (fill in blank) ? -------------------- But I don't want to ride the elevator. Posts: 420 | Registered: Sunday, January 8 2006 08:00 |