Happy Fourth of July!
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Fire! Fire! Fire! Fire!
Member # 919
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written Thursday, July 10 2003 17:13
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I agree with you, Alorael, I really do. It just pisses me off when, instead of seeing both the good and the bad, people see only the bad. That is a very common problem here. Apology accepted, Custer, just please don't do it again. That goes for everyone, actually. Rentboy, if you can't spell your own name, I think you have more problems than a bad education _files/tongue.gif) Willow, by "enforce your will on another people, another culture", I assume you mean removing a dictator that they want removed, anyway? So we're enforcing our will on them, but also enforcing their own will. Civilians deaths are mistakes, which is why war is bad, but sometimes neccesary. What a surprise, this is about to turn into another Iraq war debate. I promise to leave before another flame war starts. -------------------- And though the musicians would die, the music would live on in the imaginations of all who heard it. -The Last Pendragon TEH CONSPIRACY IZ ALL Les forum de la chance. Incaseofemergency,breakglass. Posts: 3351 | Registered: Saturday, April 6 2002 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 463
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written Thursday, July 10 2003 18:39
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It probably will, but I wasn't present for the last one... No, Sir David, that's not what I meant. We can continue this in private if you wish. -------------------- Let the soul trading begin. Posts: 431 | Registered: Monday, December 31 2001 08:00 |
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This Side Towards Enemy
Member # 3098
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written Friday, July 11 2003 09:47
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America is not the Great Satan. But on the other hand, it could be so much better. That's the point. JF, I think you'll find that almost nobody outside the US thinks the Federal Government is too big, excepting things like the Department of Homeland Security. In truth, it sometimes seems that whilst the North may have won the Civil War, it lost the Federalist against Stateist argument. -------------------- Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned I'll tell you my story, man Though I wish I'd never been born I'm loose at the seams, I've broken my dreams And my hand it shakes the pen Come on, come on now baby, Let the good times roll again Posts: 961 | Registered: Thursday, June 12 2003 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 2669
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written Friday, July 11 2003 15:36
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I'd much prefer a larger federal government that offers more services but whose leadership isn't as susceptible to political upheaval. But then, I'm not an US citizen. The IRS likes to hassle me every time i travel outside the country. Happy 11th of July. -------------------- ... Posts: 647 | Registered: Wednesday, February 19 2003 08:00 |
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Bob's Big Date
Member # 3151
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written Friday, July 11 2003 16:35
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David: War is indeed sometimes necessary, but it is a horrific monstrosity which must, in order to preserve human civilization, be used only as a last resort of self-defense. If we started a war to remove every tinpot dictator in the world, we'd end up throwing half the human population into anarchy. -------------------- In a word, gay. --Bob the Impaler Posts: 2367 | Registered: Friday, June 27 2003 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 496
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written Friday, July 11 2003 16:35
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I'm polishing my bowler hat and sash for 14th July. I hope everyone will congratulate me on my national day.... _files/wink.gif) Posts: 2333 | Registered: Monday, January 7 2002 08:00 |
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Bob's Big Date
Member # 3151
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written Friday, July 11 2003 16:38
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Is July 14th a national holiday there, or am I missing something clever and witty again? -------------------- In a word, gay. --Bob the Impaler Posts: 2367 | Registered: Friday, June 27 2003 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 2669
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written Saturday, July 12 2003 05:18
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Maybe he's originally from Kiribati. 'cause July 14th is Kiribati Independence Day!!! More likely, though, he's referring to Bastille Day in France. -------------------- ... Posts: 647 | Registered: Wednesday, February 19 2003 08:00 |
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Fire! Fire! Fire! Fire!
Member # 919
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written Saturday, July 12 2003 15:44
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Custer, I'm not suggesting every dictator at once, or even every dictator. I'm also hoping that we will get better at restoring governments in liberated countries... -------------------- And though the musicians would die, the music would live on in the imaginations of all who heard it. -The Last Pendragon TEH CONSPIRACY IZ ALL Les forum de la chance. Incaseofemergency,breakglass. Posts: 3351 | Registered: Saturday, April 6 2002 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 798
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written Saturday, July 12 2003 19:18
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[ Saturday, July 12, 2003 19:26: Message edited by: The Lord of Evil ] -------------------- Look Ma, I'm banned! Posts: 1046 | Registered: Friday, March 22 2002 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 798
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written Saturday, July 12 2003 19:25
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Like I said I love The US, I have no problems with The Gove, I just hate big Companies. I guess that's why I wrote "The Fall of Silicon Valley".Anyway if you think about it The Alqueda was like a big Company in Afaganistain. I have heard The Alqueda be refered to The Mafia of Terrorism, Bye George W Bush. But The Mafia is like a Big Criminal Company. So that would make The Alqueda a big terrorism company. So the diffrence between the Alqueda and Microsoft is that Microsoft is a computer company and The Alqueda is a Terrorism Company.So if you want to fight off The Alqueda in The US, fight Microsoft. -------------------- Look Ma, I'm banned! Posts: 1046 | Registered: Friday, March 22 2002 08:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 496
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written Sunday, July 13 2003 02:30
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_files/rolleyes.gif) 14th July makes William of Orange's victory at the battle of the Boyne and Protestant ascendancy in Ireland. Well, only Ulster for the last eighty-odd years. It's quite a big thing over here.Posts: 2333 | Registered: Monday, January 7 2002 08:00 |
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Fire! Fire! Fire! Fire!
Member # 919
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written Sunday, July 13 2003 16:19
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For the north... I still think all of Ireland should be one coutry, and none of it part of another, but hey. -------------------- And though the musicians would die, the music would live on in the imaginations of all who heard it. -The Last Pendragon TEH CONSPIRACY IZ ALL Les forum de la chance. Incaseofemergency,breakglass. Posts: 3351 | Registered: Saturday, April 6 2002 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 798
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written Monday, July 14 2003 13:47
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Ahh yes, The Britts and the Irish have been fighting for many years. The IRA wants N Ireland to be part of The Republic of South Ireland, and the Brittish Government wants N Ireland to remain part of Great Brittian. I went to a message board and the topic was a English- Irish debate. There was much tension between those two Eccnic groups.It is like The Jews and Musliums conflict in Isreal, or like The North and South issue in The U.S before the civil war. It's terrible that two groups can not share this planet. [ Monday, July 14, 2003 13:51: Message edited by: The Lord of Evil ] -------------------- Look Ma, I'm banned! Posts: 1046 | Registered: Friday, March 22 2002 08:00 |
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Fire! Fire! Fire! Fire!
Member # 919
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written Monday, July 14 2003 15:31
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Yeah, it's the basis of a lot of wars... (I don't say "all wars" because... well, look at WW2) Anyway, yeah, it is terrible... but I can't think of any solution that wold make everyone happy... I guess the best we can do is to get the militant groups to calm down. -------------------- And though the musicians would die, the music would live on in the imaginations of all who heard it. -The Last Pendragon TEH CONSPIRACY IZ ALL Les forum de la chance. Incaseofemergency,breakglass. Posts: 3351 | Registered: Saturday, April 6 2002 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 798
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written Monday, July 14 2003 17:28
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Well we could give N Ireland back to The Republic of South Ireland. Remember we reunified Germany and that worked out very well. -------------------- Look Ma, I'm banned! Posts: 1046 | Registered: Friday, March 22 2002 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 2669
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written Monday, July 14 2003 17:44
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I beg to differ. The Soviet Union first proposed reunification in 1952, but it was rejected because they wanted a neutral Germany, and Adenauer was more interested in joining Western Europe. The 1989 reunification was mostly set off by the removal of a Hungarian travel ban, which allowed over 13,000 East Germans to escape to West Germany. Honecker resigned after massive protest, and the doors were open. The US had a large part in splitting Germany up in the first place, though. Grand idea, that. -------------------- ... Posts: 647 | Registered: Wednesday, February 19 2003 08:00 |
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Lifecrafter
Member # 521
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written Monday, July 14 2003 20:11
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It is something to argue about. I think the verdict won't be heard for a few year yet. Right now alot of people are too pissed at the US to be objective, while the pro-American side is a bit to hyper-national. I think that it might of been alright if it was neutral like Austria, but when one considers that Germany, unlike Austria, would become an industrial power again with in ten years, one key to all of Europe, Germany becomes a tempting target to take. That was the fear of the US. Either that or a Germany with out strong allied control and without a German investment in Europe. Because Germany had an investment in Europe, it prevented a secondary rise of Facists. I think that also lead to a greater investment in the EU, which is good for pan-european peace. Perhaps Germany would of been better off without seperation, ok probably, but would Europe be better off? [ Monday, July 14, 2003 20:12: Message edited by: Kakashi ] -------------------- I am not really here. Posts: 956 | Registered: Wednesday, January 16 2002 08:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 517
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written Tuesday, July 15 2003 00:31
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JF, just a little education for you on the subject of Northern Ireland: The Unionists are Irish people who want to stay a part of the UK. The IRA are Irish people who want Ireland for the Irish. The problem is that they all live mixed up, so they can't be re-divided. And whenever one side proposes talks, the other side refuses to turn up. There is no mutually agreeable settlement to come to, and it's all the English representatives there (mainly military) can do to keep the terrorists from turning it into an all-out war. -E- -------------------- Let them eat cake! Polaris Boards: The System is Up. Perennially. Posts: 2314 | Registered: Tuesday, January 15 2002 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 798
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written Tuesday, July 15 2003 06:58
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So it's the Unionists fighting the IRA. Sounds like the Alqueda fighting The U.S Federal Government, only the War on Terrorism is on a much larger scale. I blame the U.S media for not covering it, all though the media has there hands full with Iraq. It seems like the only thing that makes the news is everything going on in the MidEast. But everything going on in the MidEast is the first priority. Once Osama Binladen, Mohamed Oma, Saddame Hussaine and the rest are caught I'm sure the UK conflict will get the attentin it deservs. -------------------- Look Ma, I'm banned! Posts: 1046 | Registered: Friday, March 22 2002 08:00 |
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Guardian
Member # 2476
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written Tuesday, July 15 2003 07:31
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quote:Though Ireland has always been a hotbed of fireheads, the current conflict started in 1968. -------------------- Polaris Posts: 1828 | Registered: Saturday, January 11 2003 08:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 517
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written Tuesday, July 15 2003 09:00
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The trouble with the UK conflict getting the attention it deserves is that there never has been an all-out conflict, just the two factions committing acts of terrorism against civilians (and each other, but mainly civilians.) -E- -------------------- Let them eat cake! Polaris Boards: The System is Up. Perennially. Posts: 2314 | Registered: Tuesday, January 15 2002 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 2300
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written Tuesday, July 15 2003 09:29
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Even if Ireland does eventually get outside attention, I doubt there is much that can be done. Invading Iraq/Afghanistan is one thing, but I would be surprised if an armed invasion would be approved of. After all, Iraq is in the Middle East, and Ireland is much nearer to Britain so obviously we couldn't do that - because we're so much more important than the Iraquis, aren't we? Having said that, the US didn't seem to care about invading Iraq without international approval. Perhaps when Tony Blair is ousted from office (and after the huge mess that was the Iraq war, I'm certain he will be) things will change. But I still am doubtful. -------------------- Beware of pretty girls in dance halls and parks who may be spies, as well as bicycles, revolvers, uniforms, arms, dead horses, and men lying on roads -- they are not there accidentally." - Soviet infantry manual, 1930's Posts: 267 | Registered: Wednesday, November 27 2002 08:00 |
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Guardian
Member # 2476
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written Tuesday, July 15 2003 09:39
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The mere suggestion leaves me a bit knee-weak. So just in case anyone is taking that serious - you never know - an armed invasion of Ireland by the US would be followed by a unified protest of all european nations, by force, if necessary. [ Tuesday, July 15, 2003 09:43: Message edited by: ef ] -------------------- Polaris Posts: 1828 | Registered: Saturday, January 11 2003 08:00 |
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Lifecrafter
Member # 521
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written Tuesday, July 15 2003 09:49
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Ireland is mostly over. The celtic tiger is making it so people don't give a rip. The fighting is mostly the die hards everyone thinks is crazy. Popular support is against them. The Irish have become patient, those that do care are willing to wait until Irish outnumber Scots again in 30 years or so. -------------------- I am not really here. Posts: 956 | Registered: Wednesday, January 16 2002 08:00 |