Profile for Thuryl
| Field | Value |
|---|---|
| Displayed name | Thuryl |
| Member number | 869 |
| Title | ...b10010b... |
| Postcount | 9973 |
| Homepage | http://thuryl.desperance.net/blades.html |
| Registered | Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
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| How did you got your username? in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Monday, March 28 2005 12:58
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quote:Nah, I can see where you're coming from. A few students from my course set up a forum which basically existed for the purpose of mounting email harassment campaigns against fellow students who were seen as annoying in some way. Fortunately, it essentially died off when the chief offenders got bored. As for my name, well, long, long ago I was known on Aceron's forum as LRTDeM (this name was taken from the initials of my real name, of which I have five; the E was for pronouncibility). The renaming came a few years back; I used "Thuryl" as the name of an RP character on a forum about three degrees of separation from the SW community, and the name stuck. -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| The Very First Ever Spiderweb IRC Channel! in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 21:26
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It is not the first. There was #exilechat long, long ago. -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| Scenarios in Development in Blades of Avernum | |
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...b10010b...
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 21:25
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Yes, on account of the fact that the scenario is about it no longer being lost. :P -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| Riddles in General | |
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...b10010b...
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 20:47
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Sand. You can build sandcastles, mountains erode into sand, eyeglasses are made out of the same material as sand, and you can't see very well in a sandstorm. [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 20:50: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 19:00
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quote:I would, but frankly I've read quite a lot of Lewis and so far haven't found anything he's had to say that didn't strike me as elitist backslapping. -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 18:42
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quote:I want you to give me $1000. Does that mean you're morally obligated to do so? See, this is the part where, for me, religion-based morality falls over -- even saying "you should always follow any directive of an omnipotent being who created the universe" isn't self-evidently true. "You should always follow any directive of an omnipotent being who created the universe, because if you do he'll give you anything you want" is starting to get closer, but that's making some pretty big assumptions (and is also starting to seem less like morality as we usually think of it). [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 18:47: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| How many new sects you expect to see in GF3 ? in Geneforge Series | |
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...b10010b...
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 17:58
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Her name sounds vaguely Russian, so I'm betting Sholai. -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 17:48
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quote:Hence my comment about cognitive dissonance. :P But yeah, the ancient Greek conception of virtue was considerably different from our own. I'm not sure that fact exactly helps your argument, though. EDIT: A thought. Even if it really were true that absolutely everyone felt as if it were right to do a certain thing, would that, in your view, mean that it really was right to do that thing? If the answer's no, I'm not sure how your postulated moral force helps matters. [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 17:51: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 17:32
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The ancient Greeks generally believed that the gods were perfect as well. (One would think this would require a fair bit of cognitive dissonance, but apparently they were capable of it.) Mind you, the Greeks didn't practice human sacrifice, but they did do plenty of things you wouldn't approve of. [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 17:33: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| HLPM suggestion in Blades of Avernum | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 17:21
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I'm not even sure there's actually a limit. I suppose the practical limit would be the point at which you're likely to start doing close to 30000 points of damage or healing with them, which for most spells would be a level of well over 1000. [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 17:22: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 17:16
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The trouble is that the things that pretty much all people care about are rather narrow -- limited, essentially, to the happiness of themselves and the people they know. Even when you help someone you've never met before, at the time you help him he's no longer a stranger to you -- just by seeing him and his situation, you already know something about him and he's no longer an abstract case. People focus on specific cases, not general principles, when they want to be convincing. Nobody talks about euthanasia, they talk about Terry Schiavo. Nobody talks about poverty in Africa, they talk about the child they sponsor through a charity and get a picture of every month. Few people place any serious value on the life of someone who's completely anonymous to them. -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 16:48
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That doesn't fit with my experience at all. I find it hard to believe that a loyal soldier and a conscientious objector, both believing that they're doing the right thing, are motivated by the exact same set of principles. And that's only within *our* society; traditions such as human sacrifice are so far removed from our experience that they're incomprehensible, but we have no reason to believe that the people who performed them thought there was anything wrong with them. -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| Help - Basshikava in Blades of Avernum | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 16:41
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A post-Canopy party is most definitely unreasonable for Bahssikava, and Adlerauge is unreasonable for just about *any* released scenario. :P -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 16:37
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Creator, are you really arguing that everyone has identical moral intuitions? If it were true, your argument would seem to prove too much; that all but one of the world's ethical systems were really developed for self-aggrandisement and that everyone who followed them knew that. [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 16:39: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| Help - Basshikava in Blades of Avernum | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 16:17
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Nope, I never use the character editor. Actually, my archers used slings, so I didn't have to worry about ammo. (For the final battle, though, I switched to using the few dozen javelins I'd picked up during the scenario.) There are also some spectres with crossbows near the end of the scenario; you can get quite a few bolts from them, if you do have an archer who relies on Bows skill. -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 15:50
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That's just because there are a large number of influences on people's actions, and they happen to add up in different ways for different people at different times. Schindler's actions may not have had the approval of the government, but presumably his family still did a decent job of teaching him from an early age that saving lives was a good thing. If your alleged moral motivator were a single, unified force, presumably it'd guide everyone to act in similar ways, or at least toward a common goal, but everything we see in the world suggests this isn't the case. -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 15:20
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I disagree that this is what happens in practice. My view is that a delayed choice to help is not in response to the action of some external moral force, but is instead in response to increasing anxiety occasioned by a fear, whether innate or indoctrinated, of behaviour seen as unacceptable. The exact same pattern of increasing anxiety about not performing the act until the act is performed is seen in obsessive-compulsive behaviour. Unless you want to argue that it's morally wrong for an obsessive-compulsive to fail to wash his hands 17 times before leaving the house, the argument that a delayed response indicates the action of some moral imperative inherent in the universe seems to rest on shaky ground. If you want to know why this pattern of increasing anxiety does occur, well, that's an empirical question rather than a philosophical one, but in my experience it's probably because observation of a situation over a period of time will tend to make it increasingly obvious that the problem to be addressed won't go away on its own. [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 15:26: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 14:48
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quote:How is saying that someone does something because he believes he should any different from saying that he does it because he wants to do it? Clearly on some level he did want to do it (even if only out of a vague feeling of obligation), or he wouldn't have done it. And I don't know about you, but whenever I do something that I feel as if I ought to do, I always do it with at least some anticipation that someone is going to heap praise and adulation on me for doing it, even if realistically I know that's unlikely. (And if the vanishingly remote prospect of a reward weren't enough to motivate many people, poker machines wouldn't be so popular.) [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 14:55: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 14:40
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quote:Personally, the utilitarian viewpoint holds considerable appeal for me, but even setting aside the problems of how to define well-being, such an ethical standard requires an assumption that not everybody is willing to make. Plenty of people, for example, believe in absolute rights which ought not to be violated regardless of how much doing so might contribute to general well-being. So if we cannot even get everyone to agree that the effect of an action on public well-being constitutes the standard for what is right or wrong, we cannot call that an objective standard of right and wrong, even if well-being could be measured objectively. (Another problem with such an approach is that it disconnects the concept of right from the concept that one should do what is right, thus bleeding morality of any force it might hold.) [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 14:43: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| On The Possibility of Objective Morality in General | |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 14:29
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Since there seems to be more to be said about ethical ontology, and it's currently wreaking havoc on the abortion topic, I suppose I may as well start another topic for it. quote:Now, to me, a reasonable definition of what is objectively right might look something like the following: If it is objectively right to do something, then any given individual should do that thing under any given circumstances. I hope nobody finds this statement objectionable. There is, unfortunately, a problem with the above statement, and it has to do with the word "should". Ordinarily, when we say that someone should do something, we have in the back of our minds some reason why they should do that thing. If a police officer tells me "You should not kill people because if you do then you will be imprisoned, and you would not like that", this is all very well. If a religious person tells me "You should not kill people because you will go to hell, and you would not like that", this is all very well also; it may be a true statement, it may be a false statement, but it's a statement I can understand. But how am I even to interpret the bald statement "You should not kill people"? If I ask someone "Why should I not kill people?" and he says "You should not kill people because it is right not to do so", then since by the above definition something right is something everyone should do, he is saying "You should not kill people because you should not kill people", which seems like no answer at all. -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| New Abortion Laws in General | |
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...b10010b...
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 14:13
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Okay, sorry. One more reply, then I'm done with the topic, I promise. Do we understand the concept of meaning? We have a word for it, but if you ask someone what they actually mean when they say it, they tend to wave their hands about noncommittally. Sure, we understand the concepts of intending something to be interpreted in a certain way, or of being interpreted in a certain way by a certain person, but taking away the specific individuals involved in the act of meaning and expecting "meaning" to still mean something in the absence of someone in particular for it to mean something to seems overambitious. EDIT: Not much point starting a new topic. I doubt we'll get much further than we have. Sorry for messing up this one. [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 14:19: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| New Abortion Laws in General | |
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...b10010b...
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 14:05
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quote:We haven't discovered that the universe is meaningless -- look at all the lost people in society looking for meaning, convinced that it's there to be found. Therefore, since people are looking for meaning but nobody's found it definitively enough to convince everyone else of what it is, the universe may or may not be meaningless. Personally, I'm convinced that whether or not meaning is there, the search for it is fruitless, so I've more or less given up looking. But anyway, as people seem to be saying that I'm likely to derail the topic, I won't make any further replies. Sorry. [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 14:11: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| New Abortion Laws in General | |
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...b10010b...
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 14:03
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quote:I'm not defending anything; I'm stating facts, including facts about what I approve and disapprove of. I hope it's obvious that I'm not actually trying to convince anyone else of anything. quote:If that's what they want to do, that's what they're going to do, and society as a whole will respond as it sees fit. It's not within my power as an individual to stop them. Social forces are bigger than any one of us, no matter how fervently you may disapprove. [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 14:04: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| New Abortion Laws in General | |
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...b10010b...
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 14:00
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quote:What measure of value is there other than the amount of time or money someone's willing to spend on something? quote:A mutual understanding tends to develop in any community of people who live together for long enough, even in the absence of external law enforcement. Even in our society, we're all basically out for ourselves and those we personally care about, but the system still holds together. Any such system will have aspects that are unpleasant for some, and those people will naturally exert a degree of pressure toward change, but in their own way such systems work in the long run. When you look less at what ought to happen and more at what does happen, things sort themselves out. -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
| New Abortion Laws in General | |
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...b10010b...
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written Sunday, March 27 2005 13:54
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In societies with no formal structures for law enforcement, murder generally hasn't run rampant, except in the form of localised vendettas or brief conflicts. Even if murder were completely legal, the vast majority of people wouldn't go around killing others for fear of reprisal. Society tends to reach an equilibrium eventually, with or without laws. [ Sunday, March 27, 2005 13:55: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |