The Hobbit

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AuthorTopic: The Hobbit
Warrior
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I just thought I'd bring to everybody's attention that Guillermo del Toro has now (well, last Friday) been officially announced to helm 'The Hobbit' and a second installment of the Tolkien Franchise which will cover the events between the afore-mentioned 'Hobbit' and 'The Lord of the Rings'.

I don't know about the rest of you but I'm pretty excited about this.

Read more on the topic.

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Posts: 183 | Registered: Sunday, March 19 2006 08:00
Warrior
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Well, Guillermo Del Toro...that could be interesting! I do like his movies.

But, there is no book between The Hobbit and The Fellowship of the Ring....will they make something up? Will it come from the Silmarrion? (I don't know whether I spelt that right).

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Posts: 72 | Registered: Wednesday, February 20 2008 08:00
Law Bringer
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There is some material in the appendicies giving the timeline between the two books (characters born, battles fought, etc.) and there were sections talking about the characters past histories. So it's possible to make up some based on that as a starting point, but the hobbit part will be boring since Bilbo writes his adventures and Frodo steals mushrooms.
Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00
Warrior
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That's a lot of stuff to make up still...and you're right, the hobbit part would be boring cause nothing much ever happens in the Shire. :P

I'm sure the Hobbit movie will be good, I'm just not sure about the filler movie. It could either be really bad or really good....it could be interesting seeing how Aragorn became Strider I guess.

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"And if I had the choice I'd take the voice I got / Cause it was hard to find. / You know I've come too far to wind up right back where I started." - Concrete Blonde (True)

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Posts: 72 | Registered: Wednesday, February 20 2008 08:00
Warrior
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My guess is the second movie will deal with the White Council expelling Sauron (the necromancer) from Dol Guldur. Technically this happens during the Hobbit timeline but would probably disturb that movie's pacing.

I also suspect they will try to get Aragorn's rise in there as well, as Viggo Mortensen has already signalled he would be interested to be involved.

As for Bilbo and Frodo: I think they won't be a big part of the second's movie soryline, even though I know that the writers (PJ, GDT, Fran Walsh and Philippa Boyens) are capable of surprising us.

As stated before, I am excited.

You can read what GDT has to say on the second film here.

[ Monday, April 28, 2008 22:10: Message edited by: Locmaar ]

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Always try to be true to yourself - unless you suck
Posts: 183 | Registered: Sunday, March 19 2006 08:00
Law Bringer
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quote:
Originally written by TobyLinn:

But, there is no book between The Hobbit and The Fellowship of the Ring....will they make something up? Will it come from the Silmarrion? (I don't know whether I spelt that right).
I highly doubt they would use The Silmarillion, since it takes place hundreds and thousands of years beforehand.

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Posts: 1556 | Registered: Sunday, November 20 2005 08:00
Warrior
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quote:
Originally written by Tyranicus:

I highly doubt they would use The Silmarillion, since it takes place hundreds and thousands of years beforehand.
Agreed. Should these upcoming two films be anywhere near as successful as LOTR, they might want to visit the Silmarillion in the future. There's content galore for quite a few movies. (Flight of the Noldor, the Sons of Fëanor, Beren and Luthien, Children of Húrin, not to forget the Akallabêth (Downfall of Numenor)).

[ Tuesday, April 29, 2008 00:43: Message edited by: Locmaar ]

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Always try to be true to yourself - unless you suck
Posts: 183 | Registered: Sunday, March 19 2006 08:00
Warrior
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I wonder how he's going to figure the Spanish Civil War into this one?
Posts: 178 | Registered: Saturday, March 8 2008 08:00
Warrior
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quote:
Originally written by Clavicle:

I wonder how he's going to figure the Spanish Civil War into this one?
Since he wants the second movie to focus on the rising civil war in Middle-earth, I'm confident he'll manage somehow. ;)

BTW, how did he fit the Spanish Civil War into Hellboy? I don't remember. And Blade II? Hmmm...

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Always try to be true to yourself - unless you suck
Posts: 183 | Registered: Sunday, March 19 2006 08:00
Warrior
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I love these movies (LOTR, Hobbit). They are better than the books.

Don't get me wrong the books are good, but the action is seriously lacking. The LOTR included exceptional action scenes, something I hope for in the Hobbit. Moreover, the construction of the scenes was exceptional in terms of the set.

History is fun, however, the books leave too much of the action to the imagination.

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By Committee
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Very excited about this development. I had hoped against hope that they would make this movie and that Peter Jackson and WETA Workshop would be involved. That Del Toro is taking the helm is fantastic - it will give Peter Jackson a greater opportunity to work in design and development of the story, and Del Toro is a director after his own heart.

I was astonished though, to see how much weight PJ has lost in the intervening years. Good for him, though!
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Shaper
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I prefer the books to the movies, but I agree that the movies are quite enjoyable. I'm still bothered by a few things here and there though. For instance, the elves at Helms Deep, or the ghosts at the Battle of Pelennor Fields...

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Lt. Sullust
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Posts: 2462 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00
Warrior
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quote:
Originally written by Lt. Sullust:

I prefer the books to the movies, but I agree that the movies are quite enjoyable. I'm still bothered by a few things here and there though.
I totally agree! I love the movies but I still prefer the books to them.

For instance, I am still bothered by the fact that Arwen went to rescue the hobbits by the river crossing when the Ringwraiths were attacking them...it wasn't her in the book!

ahem....please excuse my little rant :)

[ Tuesday, April 29, 2008 09:28: Message edited by: TobyLinn ]

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"And if I had the choice I'd take the voice I got / Cause it was hard to find. / You know I've come too far to wind up right back where I started." - Concrete Blonde (True)

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Law Bringer
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LotR is a tale of heroism and good triumphing over evil with only a few token losses. It makes for a good set of movies.

The Hobbit is much closer to a children's story, and the Silmarillion's stories are not really movie material. I can't see a test audience approving the general gloom of Túrin's story, let alone the incest. And the earlier stories rely much more heavily on the Valar and Tolkien's cosmology, which is probably a bit too much for most casual theater-goers.

—Alorael, who really only sees potential for great triumphant battles, and that doesn't leave much. Gil-Galad and Elendil die heroically after a long siege, which doesn't make for a good movie (c.f. Troy). The War of Wrath is too Biblical. Most other wars don't have happy endings. Great films could be made, but probably not very successful films.
Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00
Shaper
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I actually did not like LotR. The Hobbit is the only one I actually liked, and that's because it moved along at a decent pace. But the trilogy... for me, it just moved way too slowly for me to enjoy. It was, in short, mind-numbingly boring.

As for the movies, I only saw Fellowship of the Ring, and I actually fell asleep halfway through. So I don't care for LotR in either format, it seems.

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I'm sure LotR fans will be outraged at me calling LotR boring. So I'll save us all some time here and hurl some insults at myself. I'm an illiterate imbecile who has no taste and no respect for classics such as LotR.

There. Feel better, LotR fans?

On a side note, I wonder if the CoC's Harassment clause applies to oneself. Is throwing degrading comments at yourself a banning offense?

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Nioca's Citadel
Posts: 2686 | Registered: Friday, September 8 2006 07:00
Warrior
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LOL, I for one don't care if you don't like LOTR....to each his/her own I say!

Hopefully you'll like the Hobbit movie, that should be good.

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"And if I had the choice I'd take the voice I got / Cause it was hard to find. / You know I've come too far to wind up right back where I started." - Concrete Blonde (True)

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Posts: 72 | Registered: Wednesday, February 20 2008 08:00
Warrior
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Alorael,

while I agree with your assessment, I also see potential for the other films, should the franchise continue to be successful after the next couplet. If the audience (whatever that might be) won't appreciate the follow-ups it might be too late already, and we might watch some very good films bomb at the box office.

On the other hand, the team involved, whoever they may be, might be able to pull off some great films anyway. I do recall myelf not being very enthusiastic about LOTR being made into live-action films, but I must admit I was overwhelmed by the first one.

I prefer the books to the films at any rate. I read The Hobbit to my son, and The Lord of the Rings right afterwards. It was a deal we made, so he could watch the films. He insisted on being read The Silmarillion as well.

...and now my daughter is 'coming of age' :D

Furthermore, I read LOTR every other year around christmas, and the Silmarillion the years I don't read LOTR.

There are passages I don't like about the films, and even some I loath (the drinking game in the extended cut of RotK springs to mind). But at the same time I'm absolutely in love with Viggo Mortensen's Aragorn and Ian McKellen's Gandalf.

Plus, it's quicker to watch one of the movies than reading the corresponding book ;)

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Posts: 183 | Registered: Sunday, March 19 2006 08:00
Law Bringer
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I can definitely see good films, but I'm not so sure about successful films. Audiences liked LotR, but they're standard fantasy fare (since fantasy tends to range from loving imitation to outright plagiarism of LotR). The Hobbit either requires heavy changes or won't really resemble LotR in tone. And anything from the Silmarillion requires lots of work inherently to flesh it out from a bare history to a full story.

—Alorael, who can see it being done. It's just that there is no LotR but LotR in Tolkien's writings, and anyone trying to produce "another" LotR will either be unfaithful to the source material or disappointing to anyone expecting a repeat.
Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00
Law Bringer
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quote:
Originally written by Clavicle:

I wonder how he's going to figure the Spanish Civil War into this one?
Really, you couldn't see that The Hobbit is an allegory for the Spanish Civil War. Bilbo is the foreigners that come as anti-fascist fighters to aid the monarch Thorin Oakenshield. Smaug represents the fascist that have taken the country. Sauron (Hitler) is meanwhile sending supporters into neighboring lands and is repulsed in the proxy war leading up to LotR.

Okay it doesn't perfectly fit, but I'm not up on that war.
Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00
Warrior
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Alorael,

the question remains if it has to resemble LotR (film-wise) in any way other than (for many people I know too much) glorious cinematography.

I sincerely believe Peter Jackson's films where successful because of the tone and imagery set in The Fellowship Of The Ring (not to forget Viggo Mortensen and Ian McKellen). This was the film to enable him to pull the others off.

To my mind RotK was the weakest film in the trilogy, but it was the most successful one, if I remember correctly (and I'm not talking about Academy Awards).

When speaking of other genre films, I have a hard time recalling anything significant other than Conan, possibly Willow or The Princess Bride (a true gem). There were a few others, but their light doesn't shine very brightly anymore (unless I made a great faux-pas and forgot something of true grandeur which is entirely possible, seeing that it's close to midnight).

One ting I know for sure: I have two little people living with me, with coincidentily very large feet, who are very enthuiastic about The Hobbit. One can't wait to watch a Middle-earth based film on the big screen, while the other is now hot to have The Hobbit read to her. And I am most willing to comply ;)

edit: Randomizer: You are of course aware that Tolkien despised allegory? ;)

[ Tuesday, April 29, 2008 13:01: Message edited by: Locmaar ]

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Law Bringer
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Yes, but then he had to listen to heaping doses of it from C. S. Lewis. That would be enough to sour it for anyone.
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By Committee
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From what I understand from reading interviews, the intent of Del Toro and PJ is to use the same design elements and make certain that there is a continuity there (Alan Lee and John Howe will both likely be involved again), but to give these elements more of a "golden" or child-like/younger sort of luster.

I think the Hobbit will be great! So many elements of that story were episodic so that while they may not all make it into the film, many of them will. Certainly the trolls, the encounter with Gollum, and Smaug, to be sure. Whether Beorn, the Wood Elves, or too much of Dale will make it in remains to be seen.
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Law Bringer
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The Wood Elves will. It's an excuse to throw in a Legolas cameo, assuming they can get Orlando Bloom for a few days.

—Alorael, who thinks the movie will probably be easier to shoot with all short characters (plus Gandalf). Less camera trickery is needed.
Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00
Warrior
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Incidentally, when I was a kid I loved C.S. Lewis' books. Especially The Dawn Treader. Of course, if it was Lewis' intention to fix Christian convictions within me, he failed miserably... .

In fact, I don't know what C.S. Lewis' Christian 'intention' was, if in fact he had any at all beyond just expressing himself.

That aside... no one get me started on the Rings films... ugh. And this is coming from somebody who liked Peter Jackson's earlier films, thought Heavenly Creatures was a brilliant film (I still do, despite some of the gratuitous Spielbergesque swooping), and really looked forward to the first Rings film. Oh, well. Until King Kong came along, I comforted myself in thinking he'd probably put up his best fight against Hollywood, without which he couldn't have made the Trilogy in as nearly the way he wanted to make it.

[EDITED for unwarranted rambling]

[ Tuesday, April 29, 2008 18:12: Message edited by: Clavicle ]
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Raven v. Writing Desk
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Read the part of TLTWATW where they sacrifice Aslan, and tell me if it doesn't sound like Mel Gibson should be playing the lion.

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