The New World

AuthorTopic: The New World
Infiltrator
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As there is no forum truly for this subject, I have put it in General for the eyes of all viewers. The current plans if I'm not mistaken are G5, A6 and then... a new world. What will this world be like do you think? Will there be multiple PCs like Avernum, or will there be a singleton like Geneforge. Will there be traditional magic like Avernum, or will there be radical magic like Shaping? Can you choose your very own side, or will it be pre-set? And what will the new engine be like?

I'm hoping that the engine will have two levels of elevation in the same area. This could lead to more interesting combat situations, where you're positioning is more important. I also hope there will be a more radical plot line like Geneforge, which I like better than Avernum. Then it will be more of a surprise in the plot.
Posts: 626 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00
Infiltrator
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I think only Jeff can accurately answer this. Then time period could be any time, even futuristic. Both of the PC chioces could happen, or it could be completely different. I don't think it will include any extremely radical magic, but new ideas are good. The side idea seems very interesting, it has many possibilities. Hopefully the engine will not be too radical, such as adding 3D, that would revolutionize SW, for good or bad. The elevation thing is interesting but would add much complexity to making the game. Who wouldn't want a radical plot?

[ Tuesday, November 27, 2007 18:19: Message edited by: The Ratt ]

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Posts: 454 | Registered: Monday, August 20 2007 07:00
Shaper
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He could probably use a break. He's spent the past decade or so trying to please us, despite the fact that we are always complaining about one thing or another...

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Lt. Sullust
Quaere verum
Posts: 2462 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00
Law Bringer
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Jeff hinted that it might be a new world. The other thing he said was he was looking at 3D game engines, but whether he will go that route isn't certain.

I doubt he will commit himself until he's working on Avernum 6 because by then he will have started to outline the plot.
Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00
? Man, ? Amazing
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I think it would be funny if he released the finals in both Geneforge and Avernum and then, after a suitable pause to work out the bugs, dropped the forums completely. Unexplained absence would only heighten the anticipation for his next stage.

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Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00
Law Bringer
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Stygia 1! It's time to updated that dated A1-3 series!

—Alorael, who sincerely hopes not. Having the Avernum games run on Leopard would be nice, but having them upgraded isn't necessary.
Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00
Law Bringer
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Jeff will probably upgrade them in his "spare" time. From his remarks he will remake the series some day. Maybe we can convince him to drop that whole Vahnatai debacle from the remake of Avernum 4. Having the shades disrupt Avernum would make more sense for the Darkside Loyalists since it divides an enemy while they grow their base.
Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00
Lifecrafter
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I dearly hope Jeff keeps to the Avernum and Geneforge genre, for possibly the sole reason thay my internet connection can only handle those type of downloads!

But seriously, I doubt random speculation (at the most) or random spam (At the least) in this thread will produce anything of value.

/Begs self not to post personal opinian.
Posts: 942 | Registered: Sunday, October 8 2006 07:00
Shock Trooper
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I saw the topic and thought that is would be about "The New World Order." Thankfully it's not, I had a co-worker that would rant about it all day even if you asked him to stop.

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Posts: 228 | Registered: Monday, October 21 2002 07:00
Agent
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Incorporating three-dimensional graphics would be a monetary strain on Jeff.

I'd love to see a remake of Omega. (A role playing game released in the nineteen eighties)

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Jesus is a pacifist.
Ron Paul for '08!
Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00
Agent
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Something in the Golden Age of Piracy would be nice. You know, that time period when guns were around but not good enough, so swords were still used. Good times.

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"I'm happy I'm the mentally disturbed person I am."
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Posts: 1186 | Registered: Friday, June 18 2004 07:00
Law Bringer
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I still want Steampunk. Dirigibles and ancient mechanisms. Arcanum was nice, but SW's stuff has a unique feel to it.

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Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00
Electric Sheep One
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Yeah, I think Jeff could do something like Arcanum very well. It could carry on a bit of the flavor of Geneforge, but only a bit.

The problem is that as an indie Jeff can afford even less than a big company to do anything that seems like it's been done before. If people are willing to rehash something familiar, they at least demand cutting edge graphics with it. So Jeff could do something that was a bit like Arcanum in some respects, but it really couldn't be that much like it.

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Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00
Lifecrafter
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I've had a consistent milieu idea for some time, but considering how little interest I have in actually acting on it...

Essentially, there's a few humongous lacunas in the RPG pseudomythos. You could readily create an enormous and engaging world based on Polynesia, the Mesoamericans, the Bantu, or damned near any group in South Asia. On the other hand, only one of those provides me with everything I want out of epic history: intrigue, colonialism, imperial gotterdammerung, whose-God-is-bigger contests, and firearms.

I am of course talking about India, circa 1650-1700. Without any major pseudohistory, the fall of the Mughal Empire and the rise of European dominance would make for an outstanding Nethergate-style RPG history of India. And that's just the best era for it; around the time of Diu, there was a vigorous imperial competition between Portugal and the Ottomans, rather than the fairly homogeneous imperial powers in the 17th century. The last stand of Tipu Sultan is also extremely interesting to me; he was a French client, a foreign auxillary of the Jacobins (in spite of being, you know, a sultan and all), and launched what could pretty easily be called the final serious national resistance to British rule. And he did it with a serious eye to modernization; he was an avid technophile, a military mastermind, a vociferous producer and consumer of gadgets - the sort of historical figure steampunk would dream about if it had ever met a brown man it liked.

The best scenario for something like that would definitely be in the mid-17th, though. The British were just beginning to come ahead among the wide field of European merchants and colonists - not only them and the French, but the Dutch, the Portuguese, and even Denmark. Meanwhile, the Mughal Empire, the go-to imperial power throughout the Subcontinent, had had its last good emperor and was sliding into irrelevance. The most interesting angle is the religious one, per NG - it'd be very easy to cast the goings-on in a supernatural light, the old gods ruling the countryside and God - whether they call him Allah or Christ - ruling the cities.

Add that to all of the absolutely amazing monsters, weapons, and other miscellaneous things - including the 'juggernaut', a massive flaming chariot belonging to one of the Hindu gods (I forget who, exactly, but there was a custom of building the most enormous temple-on-wheels you could and running it through the city teamed to a bunch of horses or oxen during festival days - which lead to the British adoption of the term to describe an unstoppable force destroying everything in its path, as a loose juggernaut chariot would - and, all too often, did.) There's all kinds of weird, interesting stuff in the Indian subcontinent that shows up in a corrupted, less bad-ass form in the modern RPG - the thuggees, the forest monks, pretty much every Hindu deity - that it seems a crime against gaming that this game *hasn't* been made.

Ah well.

[ Friday, November 30, 2007 02:21: Message edited by: Najosz Thjsza Kjras ]
Posts: 794 | Registered: Tuesday, October 11 2005 07:00
Infiltrator
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Do you guys think this game will be historical, or completely fiction. I'm fine either way because the games are always good, but if it was historical I hope for something similar to the legend of El Cid. Its quite an interesting story that would be great for a game.
Posts: 626 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00
Law Bringer
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This sounds like a brilliant idea, Alec.

I didn't get one part though:

quote:
the sort of historical figure steampunk would dream about if it had ever met a brown man it liked
Is steampunk inherently racist? How so?

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The Noble and Ancient Order of Polaris - We're Not Yet Dead.
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Did-chat thentagoespyet jumund fori is jus, hat onlime gly nertan ne gethen Firyoubbit 'obio.'
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Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00
Agent
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I'm not a fan of historic RPG's, however I do like historic RPG's. (AoE for example)

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Jesus is a pacifist.
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Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00
Infiltrator
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quote:
I'm not a fan of historic RPG's , however I do like historic RPG's . (AoE for example)
Huh?
Posts: 626 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00
Guardian
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Nalyd thinks he means historic RTS's.

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Posts: 1636 | Registered: Wednesday, January 5 2005 08:00
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quote:
Originally written by Arancaytar:



quote:
the sort of historical figure steampunk would dream about if it had ever met a brown man it liked
Is steampunk inherently racist? How so?

Not inherently. But the problem I've always seen is this:

a) It focuses with laser-like precision on Whitey - to be fair, as of 1880 or so the big man on campus was Britain and the scrappy underdog Germany, but then again the Chinese were in a major spate of modernization (with the world's 8th-strongest navy, until Cixi lost interest), and Ethiopia had recently triumphed where the smart money was on Italy. It's always just struck me as odd that steampunk basically throws all of the agency onto upper-class Brits - sometimes lower-class Brits, but it's too much to ask to have a darkie involved. Which brings me to my second point:

b) Given how, out of the wealth of possibilities existing in 'fulfilling the promises the 19th century made for the future', the authors working in steampunk just so happen always to beeline for some European power being just slightly more dominant over everyone - well, there's certainly an element of wish-fulfillment at work there, and it's not a good one.

c) The same subkultur that produces steampunk is generally associated with the fandoms around Lovecraft (whose stories were about the dilution and destruction of civilization by an ancient, fecund race of vicious subhumans) and Howard (whose stories were about the ancient and glorious civilization of the Aryans); it has close ties with generalized geekdom, which has more race issues than you can shake ESR's blog at.

d) Given the above, I don't think I'm really going out on much of a limb saying that most steampunk is gonna have negative racial elements, ranging from subtle to profound. The European empires shot millions and starved millions more; you write a story whose purpose is to fantasize about what it'd be like if they had their hands on *everyone*, and someone's gotta ask a few important questions about what on Earth your motivation is.

Incidentally: it wouldn't be too difficult to basically write the story of Tipu Sultan's last stand to be more or less identical to Nethergate. This means it's bound to happen eventually.

I know how Vogel do.

[ Friday, November 30, 2007 18:12: Message edited by: Najosz Thjsza Kjras ]
Posts: 794 | Registered: Tuesday, October 11 2005 07:00
Agent
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Chances are, though, that nothing mentioned here will ever feature in a game that Vogel makes - the last thing he probably need is to risk having someone whine heartily afterwards about intellectual copyright, no matter how good the idea or how willingly it is given.
Posts: 1487 | Registered: Sunday, February 10 2002 08:00