Root of all evil
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Shock Trooper
Member # 3898
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written Tuesday, January 18 2005 23:30
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I would like to suggest that prejudice is the root of, if not all, a significant amount of evil. I would also like to suggest that it can be argued that any moral/ethical code is the root of all evil, as if there were no morals, there would be nothing that could be considered immoral. Also, given that predjudice is the root of most evil, *all* Exile fans are irrevocably idiotic. If you fail to understand the meaning of that statement, you are pathetically stupid and deserve only to be treated as if you adhered to the view in the second paragraph. -------------------- ~Note : The professional newbie's advice should not be taken seriously, or at all.~ LINKAGE Posts: 364 | Registered: Saturday, January 17 2004 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 618
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written Tuesday, January 18 2005 23:53
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Actually, the modern cause of evil is boredom. We are all supposed to live in a modern age where life is easy. Unfortunately, in the average area, there are not enough amenities to take care of all the extra time. So we are used to squandering and wasting time. If everyone had something to do, then there wouldn't be a group of people sitting around and thinking about declaring war on another country or going out and blowing up a train. -------------------- Aut Tace Aut Loquere Meliora Silencio Posts: 1487 | Registered: Sunday, February 10 2002 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 2984
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written Tuesday, January 18 2005 23:53
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quote:Yup. 'Tis one of the many wonders of Spiderweb, and possibly one of the reasons General and Misc have flourished throughout history (the insanity and the roleplays also contribute) -------------------- The Encyclopaedia Ermariana <-- Now a Wiki! "Polaris leers down from the black vault, winking hideously like an insane watching eye which strives to convey some strange message, yet recalls nothing save that it once had a message to convey." --- HP Lovecraft. "I single Aran out due to his nasty temperament, and his superior intellect." --- SupaNik Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 07:46
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quote:Do you mean that the extra time in a person's day should not exist, in that people should spend all their time on the basic neccessities of life? This would require a massive regression in technology. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this seems like a very ludite/reactionary viewpoint. Either way evil would still exist (the point I believe mung was making). Its cause(s) can be found, but they cannot be eradicated. Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 2984
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 08:04
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Boredom is not the root of evil, in as much as progress is not the root of evil. What both are used for may, under some circumstances, be classified as such, but it's like saying metal is evil because you can make guns from it. -------------------- The Encyclopaedia Ermariana <-- Now a Wiki! "Polaris leers down from the black vault, winking hideously like an insane watching eye which strives to convey some strange message, yet recalls nothing save that it once had a message to convey." --- HP Lovecraft. "I single Aran out due to his nasty temperament, and his superior intellect." --- SupaNik Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 4256
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 08:26
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Sentient life forms are the root of all evil. :P What animals do is not often considered evil though it may be harsh. So, to eradicate evil in this world all that needs to be done is detonate a large nuke and destroy the planet. Sure the act in itself would be evil, but it would serve the purpose. The only problem is that to destroy the evil you would also have to destroy all that is good. Posts: 564 | Registered: Wednesday, April 14 2004 07:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 5246
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 08:56
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Blaming religion is a mute point. There isn't a religion that is recognized by the world as such that actually promotes violence. (Obviously this can be argued... but lets be realists here and agree) Religion if anything provides a sense of order to an otherwise chaotic human order. Today the standard that is echoed is, "do what you want." When you listen to your heart you can't go wrong. Restraint has become the words of old boring men. The only thing countering this in todays society is religion. Illegitimate children, broken homes, finacial troubles, and selfishness are results of this kind of thinking. Blaming religion as the root of all evil is not only immature, but very very not well thought out. Everything that we see in the world including ourselves shout and demand that there is a higher power. The only thing in the world that recognizes a higher power is religion. I understand that this will not be taken well, but I would have to say that selfishness is the root of all evil, and furthermore that evil is not an item or thing, it comes from individuals. Murder would not happen had someone not committed it, and this line of reasoning can go on and on forever. We as humans are accountable for our own actions... whethey they be good or bad. My personal beliefs are that there is a head of evil... we all know its name. To blame something or someone other than ourselves for evil is simply missing the point. We are not forced to do anything. We can resist anything. It is our free agency. We have only ourselves to blame. BTW this post is not to belittle or demoralize anyone elses beliefs. I respect everyones opinions. Its variety that gives the world its flair. Posts: 24 | Registered: Friday, December 3 2004 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 09:44
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quote:All systems do this, or at least try to. quote:Restraint leads to opression. Opression leads to revolution, and resulting is the mentioned "do what you want" philosophy. (This'll go back to restraint eventually.) Again, other types of systems stress restraint. quote:Although religion can be, and usually is, viewed as the culmination of all that is good, it can (not always) be very evil. An example of this would be the Catholic Church's medieval practices of indulgences, inquisitions, etc. The crusades are another, and the human-dictated result of the Nicene Conferences are yet antother. (The last one mainly has to do with corruption.) The basic cause for this is that religion, or more accurately organized religion, contains politics, and therefore the potential for corruption. The fact that God can be used as a justification for anything doesn't help either. Blaming religion as the root of all evil is not immature, just short-sighted. quote:Well said. quote:Same here. [ Wednesday, January 19, 2005 09:45: Message edited by: KernelKnowledge12 ] Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 4256
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 09:59
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quote:Self Restraint should not lead to opression. Governmental restraint does. Some religions/sects advocate both kinds of restraint, some just one, but almost any that tend towards governmental restraint seem likely to follow the pattern you describe. "Do what you want" also leads to revolution. It breeds weakness into empires and is very important in the rise and fall of nations. Part the challenge for any society is to balance "restraint" with "freedom" in an equilibrium so that the people remain "strong" but happy. Posts: 564 | Registered: Wednesday, April 14 2004 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 10:03
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quote:Hence the 60s. Also, I did not mean that the "Do what you want" statement as part of the cycle I wrote. Doesn't change the merit of the above quote, though. Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 11:52
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Having given it some thought, I think that the root of all evil is society. Given that there seems to be some sort of consensus here (I'm kind of grasping at straws) that the state of nature the animals live in is not evil, evil can only be rooted in what humanity has done to avoid the state of nature. In creating rules (whether divinely inspired or no), certain behaviors, actions, or things/people themselves become outliers, and so are considered evil. The temptation then is to condemn society, but I think to do so is mistaken, given all the benefits or "good" that society provides. In fact, I think one could just as easily assert that society is the root of all good as well. [ Wednesday, January 19, 2005 11:54: Message edited by: Andrew Miller ] Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 12:43
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Society is what we call our adaptation of herd mentality coupled with sapience. There's nothing inherently evil in forming a herd, so the only option there is saying that all evil stems from sapience. You know what? I'd agree with that. You pretty much have to agree with that if you accept the premise that animals are not and never can be evil. The question of whether sapience is the direct cause of evil or whether there are intermediate steps remains. —Alorael, who would say that there's something in the Genesis notion of humans being the only organism with knowledge of good and evil. The Bible certainly isn't the authoritative source of the why for all human beings, and it's equally bad at giving the universal message of what to do about it, but at least it states the problem. Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 4256
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 13:52
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Yeah I guess sapience is a better word for it than sentience, but I don''t think that many people would say that sapience was inherently evil either. It does seem to be the ultimate root of evil though. On the flip side it would also be the root of all that is good. One can hardly call the animals capable of doing good if they aren't capable of doing evil. Posts: 564 | Registered: Wednesday, April 14 2004 07:00 |
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Bob's Big Date
Member # 3151
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 15:19
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Dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return. -------------------- The biggest, the baddest, and the fattest. Posts: 2367 | Registered: Friday, June 27 2003 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 19:07
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As of now I'm inclined to believe the root of all evil has to do with the formation of society, since the implicitly defined rules that a society creates serve as a definition for good and evil, among other things. Since simply having sapience does not neccessarily give a being an understanding of good and evil, it cannot be either (in its own perspective). A being can only be evil, if it knows what evil is and can therefore choose to be evil. Unless there is such a thing as an inherently evil thing. [ Wednesday, January 19, 2005 19:08: Message edited by: KernelKnowledge12 ] Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00 |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 21:08
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"Evil" is just a word, and language is defined by its usage. If we all agreed there was no such thing as evil, it wouldn't exist. The problem is that that wouldn't really change anything. On a more serious note, I haven't seen anyone in this topic so far define what they mean by "evil". Perhaps, after all, "evil" is a word that has had its day; perhaps using it only leads to confusion and argument. Perhaps it would be easier to reach a consensus on what is desirable and undesirable rather than what is good and evil. Perhaps it would be preferable to focus on promoting what is desirable and eliminating what is undesirable, rather than debating ethical semantics. [ Wednesday, January 19, 2005 21:10: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 2984
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 21:27
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It's in human nature to think in Good/Evil terms. You can't abolish the binary thought, you can only suppress it with the neutral point of view. If you do try to abolish it completely, we will be totally disoriented. We need a basic idea that we can latch on to that we see as absolute good or absolute evil. It's up to us to make that idea what we want, but I don't think you're able to live without one. -------------------- The Encyclopaedia Ermariana <-- Now a Wiki! "Polaris leers down from the black vault, winking hideously like an insane watching eye which strives to convey some strange message, yet recalls nothing save that it once had a message to convey." --- HP Lovecraft. "I single Aran out due to his nasty temperament, and his superior intellect." --- SupaNik Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00 |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Wednesday, January 19 2005 22:03
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Really? Because I sure can't think of anything that I regard as either entirely good or entirely evil; or even, to use more neutral language, entirely beneficial or harmful. Any event will bring its own advantages and disadvantages to different people. In fact, there isn't really anything that I have a visceral positive or negative reaction to any more. Maybe that means I've learned to take a more detached view, or maybe I've just stopped caring; maybe those are two ways of saying the same thing. [ Wednesday, January 19, 2005 22:06: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 4256
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written Thursday, January 20 2005 06:43
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quote:Really? Pardon the crudeness of my example, but.... You would have no objections to raping your mother besides the "intellectual" ones? That is rather scary. Hmmm, perhaps I just realized what most people on these boards knew all along. :P Posts: 564 | Registered: Wednesday, April 14 2004 07:00 |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Thursday, January 20 2005 15:57
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Oh, I'd object to it if it actually happened, sure. There are plenty of things I wouldn't like or approve of if they happened, but just the idea of it doesn't really bother me, especially since it's an unlikely event. I guess you could say I've given up thinking in the abstract. [ Thursday, January 20, 2005 15:58: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
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written Thursday, January 20 2005 19:10
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quote:I don't usually agree with what Hobbes says, but this seems to be an exception. Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00 |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Thursday, January 20 2005 20:08
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Doesn't seem like a universally acceptable definition. There are plenty of religious types around (and a few non-religious ones as well) who think the things they themselves enjoy are evil. [ Thursday, January 20, 2005 20:08: Message edited by: Thuryl ] -------------------- My BoE Page Bandwagons are fun! Roots Hunted! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 2984
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written Thursday, January 20 2005 20:20
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quote:Of course, the riddle is: Do they enjoy not enjoying these things? If you are a Puritan, does it give you pleasure to keep pleasure out of your life? It is then a pleasure to be a Puritan, and thus a contradiction in terms? Am I too tired? -------------------- The Encyclopaedia Ermariana <-- Now a Wiki! "Polaris leers down from the black vault, winking hideously like an insane watching eye which strives to convey some strange message, yet recalls nothing save that it once had a message to convey." --- HP Lovecraft. "I single Aran out due to his nasty temperament, and his superior intellect." --- SupaNik Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 4256
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written Thursday, January 20 2005 20:40
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quote:Not very helpful. It uses terms such as Wicked and Sinful. It then terms sin as an offense against moral or religious law. If you believe in evil/good do you have to believe in sin? Is it wrong to commit evil? Would it be possible t o have a value system that recognized that what you were doing was wrong, but did not say that it was "wrong" to do wrong? quote:It would seem to me that such a religion would entail hypocricy to its very core. I wasn't under the imprssion that they thought the pleasure in and of itself was wrong, but that doing things merely for pleasure was wrong. Still a hard view, but much more livable than pleasuer is wrong. Posts: 564 | Registered: Wednesday, April 14 2004 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 156
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written Friday, January 21 2005 04:26
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quote:Actually, this is not true(that man's nature demands he worship...). While religion itself is an evolutionary trait that once served as an advantageous survival adaption, like many/most such adaptions, it is becoming a DISADVANTAGE. Too much to get into in this post but there are millions of atheists who do not worship anything. This is actually becoming a common use definition for atheism in many circles. Many people have worshipped the sun as a god. I do not deny or doubt the sun's existence but I do not willingly worship it(or anything else) as a deity. Worship is a bad idea all around. No sentient thing deserving of worship would want it and to worship an unworthy thing/entity demans US. -------------------- "I am in a very peculiar business. I travel all over the world telling people what they should already know." - James Randi Posts: 219 | Registered: Saturday, October 13 2001 07:00 |