Avernum 4 or Nethergate 2

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AuthorTopic: Avernum 4 or Nethergate 2
Infiltrator
Member # 4592
Profile #0
This may be a redundant poll because there's currently at least one thread which is discussing A4 and N2, and both have been discussed all over the place, but it seemed like a good idea (?!) to see the discussion in the form of numbers.
This poll has been moved to another forum.

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quote:

"I suffer from spiritual malaise," said Cugel meaningfully. "which manifest itself in outburst of vicious rage. I implore you to depart, lest, in an uncontrollable spasm, I cut you in three pieces with my sword, or worse, I invoke magic."
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Posts: 604 | Registered: Sunday, June 20 2004 07:00
Shaper
Member # 73
Profile #1
I say Nethergate 2. Avernum 4 would undoubtably vastly contradict the stories established by the BoE community. Plus, I'm fairly certain he's stated several times that he will not make an Exile/Avernum 4.

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Posts: 2957 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00
Fire! Fire! Fire! Fire!
Member # 919
Profile #2
I say A4 would be better. You just can't make a sequel to Nethergate. Avernum... you can certainly make a sequel to that. In fact, I'm sure somebody will. So why not Jeff?

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Polaris = joy.

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Posts: 3351 | Registered: Saturday, April 6 2002 08:00
Agent
Member # 618
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In the sense of fans' hearts, A4 is alot more believable than N2. However, jusdging the information, the wording and the actual sequel potenial, I would say it's N2.

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Aut Tace Aut Loquere Meliora Silencio
Posts: 1487 | Registered: Sunday, February 10 2002 08:00
Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
Profile Homepage #4
I hope it's N2, but I highly doubt that it is. After the mention in the Wrap about A4 being likely and the mailing list message about a series that had been waiting for a long time to be continued, I think it's A4. If it were N2, I don't think he'd be so careful with his phrasing.

There are right ways and wrong ways to make an A4, and while I hope that his apparent change of perspective with regards to Blades (as evidenced in his actions regarding fixing debug mode and line numbers, and his statements in the Wrap) is enough that he has chosen a right way to make A4, I doubt it. It would mean keeping abreast of BoA scenarios and keeping in communication with the community about our plotlines. While he has improved since BoE, I don't know if he's improved that much.

Nethergate 2, on the other hand, could be really cool.

EDIT: Alo also said that he's positive that it's A4. I don't know if he's just had too much skribbane, but if he's sure, I'll take his word for it. And I have similar doubts to his about how well a direct sequel to Nethergate would work, but it seems like the Nethergate universe would be a better one in which to work than the Avernum one.

[ Saturday, July 17, 2004 17:06: Message edited by: Just Call Me Kel ]

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Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens.

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Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00
BANNED
Member # 4
Profile Homepage #5
Neither.

Goddammit, can't Jeff do something NEW rather than making hash-sequels?

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人 た ち を 燃 え る た め に 俺 は か れ ら に 火 を 上 げ る か ら 死 ん だ
Posts: 6936 | Registered: Tuesday, September 18 2001 07:00
Fire! Fire! Fire! Fire!
Member # 919
Profile #6
Ohh... two mistakes. First, I thought you were asking which we'd prefer. Second, I hadn't read the email until five minutes ago. I don't know about Alorael, but I'd say it's NG2. Avernum has not "waited a long time to be continuted".

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And though the musicians would die, the music would live on in the imaginations of all who heard it.
-The Last Pendragon

Polaris = joy.

In case of emergency, break glass.
Posts: 3351 | Registered: Saturday, April 6 2002 08:00
Warrior
Member # 4654
Profile #7
A4 by any way. it would be cooooooool.and i loved A3. AND A123 are my fav SpidWeb games!

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Posts: 78 | Registered: Friday, July 2 2004 07:00
Infiltrator
Member # 4637
Profile Homepage #8
I would prefer a SF theme. But if I had to choose between those two... Maybe Nethergate 2, with Avernum's engine (or an improved version of it). Just because there's already 4 avernum games, plus the scenarios players will do. :)

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"Beware lest anyone cheat you through philosophy and empty deceit, according to the tradition of men, according to the basic principles of the world, and not according to Christ." Colossians 2:6-9
Posts: 483 | Registered: Tuesday, June 29 2004 07:00
Lifecrafter
Member # 4682
Profile #9
Actually, I don't want either, but I'd prefer to have A4 because a sequel to Nethergate would be really forced. Well, A4 would be too, but not as much.

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If anyone ever asks you why you did something, say "Because I could".
Posts: 834 | Registered: Thursday, July 8 2004 07:00
Agent
Member # 2820
Profile #10
Nethergate 2 with a 'sparkly' new engine would be pretty cool. Nethergate 1 was plagued with control issues and it was Jeff's first attempt at the new engine. But the game was pretty good nonetheless.

Imagine Romans actually working together!

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Posts: 1415 | Registered: Thursday, March 27 2003 08:00
Law Bringer
Member # 335
Profile Homepage #11
quote:
Originally written by Lady Davida:

Avernum has not "waited a long time to be continuted".
The story has been waiting since E3. Sure, he made Avernum, but it didn't add very much to the world of Avernum. A1 brought in Lost B and the story of the sliths, and that's all.

—Alorael, who doesn't have any particular knowledge on the matter. He's just predicting A4 very strongly. It may be part of his eternal pessimism, because a bad A4 has a lot more potential to be really, really bad than a bad N2.
Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00
Bob's Big Date
Member # 3151
Profile Homepage #12
A good A4 would be awful. It would be yet another Vogelian gesture of contempt towards the BoE community; they suffered for years under Exile's limitations because Jeff abandoned Exile, with the basic assumption that Exile was the community's now.

The Avernum games always stuck in my craw, and making an Avernum 4 would really hurt -- he said he wouldn't make it for Exile. And really, what's he going to do for plot? Looking at Geneforge, his writing skills haven't changed much -- it'll probably be the Vahnatai, or the Sliths, or demons, or the Empire, doing something dastardly for no good reason.

Here's to hoping it's Nethergate 2, I guess. Far be it for me to tell Mr. Vogel which of his lovely little cash cows to milk dry.

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Posts: 2367 | Registered: Friday, June 27 2003 07:00
Senile Reptile
Member # 547
Profile #13
I'd hope for an entirely new game of some sort. Geneforge was a welcome break from the avernum/exile interface - although I don't mind those, new things're nice sometimes.

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Polaris
Posts: 1614 | Registered: Wednesday, January 23 2002 08:00
Guardian
Member # 3521
Profile #14
I would enjoy playing through the hypothetical A4, but I, too, doubt that such a game would offer anything truly new at all in terms of plot or gameplay. N2 would inspire quite a bit more excitement in me, but, as others have mentioned, a world entirely without magic is hardly fertile ground for a game designer of Vogel's capabilities, although I do feel that a magic-free concept could work, as I believe I stated in an earlier topic. All it would require would be some degree of originality in terms of advanced weaponry skills and the availability of a greater variety of conventional weapons. Creating balanced gameplay would be a challenge, but it could be done.

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Stughalf

"Delusion arises from anger. The mind is bewildered by delusion. Reasoning is destroyed when the mind is bewildered. One falls down when reasoning is destroyed."- The Bhagavad Gita.
Posts: 1798 | Registered: Sunday, October 5 2003 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 4423
Profile #15
I'd like a SF one too... but since its a sequel, I hope Nethergate 2. I mean, isn't the Avernum universe going to be big enough, with players making all the scenarios they want?

And I liked the Nethergate system better... the extra spells are just good (too bad it's still less then Exile, but I can live with a little less then Exile).

I also agree with what others have said... there's only so many sequels and remakes I can take. Course, Jeff's sequels and remakes are better than anybody else's originals, but still.

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"When your teacher needs a calculator to add up how many you missed more than you need a calculator to take a calc test, that's bad."
Posts: 44 | Registered: Tuesday, May 25 2004 07:00
Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
Profile Homepage #16
Having given this a bit more thought, it seems obvious that it's A4. The number of e-mails he's gotten asking for a new Avernum (and add in the ones asking for Exile 4, too, because I'm sure he counts them as the same thing) surely FAR outweigh the number of e-mails he's gotten asking for a new Nethergate. Besides, E3 was SW's most commercially successful game ever, while Nethergate was probably JV's biggest flop. He will go where the money is, and the money is in an A4.

To anyone who still thinks that it is anything other than N2 or A4: it has to be one of these two, by process of elimination. JV has made four series: Exile, Nethergate, Avernum, and Geneforge. He only markets and did not make the other SW games, so it can't be one of them. GF3 is already in the pipeline, and we know about it. That means that it's either E4, N2, or A4. E4 is exceedingly unlikely, because he wanted to make a new engine, according to the Wrap (link in the BoA forum). That leaves N2 or A4, and by the above argument, it's almost certainly A4. He has a built-in audience: everyone who played any of the Exile or Avernum games (of which there are a total of eight, at this point). Meanwhile, Nethergate has only the one game.

This game is A4, and we in the community have to decide what we're going to do about that (particularly BoA people).

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Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens.

Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me
The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever
Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00
Shaper
Member # 73
Profile #17
I say what we should do about it is boycott Spidweb and switch to Pygmalion.
Then again, that's just out of anger that Jeff would smack the community in the face by releasing A4. I've never actually seen Pyg, so I shouldn't really comment on it.
Although Jeff inspired me to write RPGs and start my own business, he also taught me how not to behave toward your gaming community.

[ Sunday, July 18, 2004 16:50: Message edited by: The Almighty Doer of Stuff ]

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The Lyceum - The Headquarters of the Blades designing community
The Louvre - The Blades of Avernum graphics database
Alexandria - The Blades of Exile Scenario database
BoE Webring - Self explanatory
Polaris - Free porn here
Odd Todd - Fun for the unemployed (and everyone else too)
Famous Last Words - A local pop-punk band
They Might Be Giants - Four websites for one of the greatest bands in existance
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Posts: 2957 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 4423
Profile #18
After all the times he said he would NOT make an A4, with all the damage it would do to the story line... if he ever did, there is nothing in this world that could get me to play it. I like Exile, I like Nethergate, I'm ok with Avernum and I like BoA, but if it's going on to A4... strategy games and Fallout will be all that's left. There simply aren't many good RPGs these days, and to see Jeff fail so completely would be disasterous.

[ Sunday, July 18, 2004 16:59: Message edited by: MasterXan ]

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"When your teacher needs a calculator to add up how many you missed more than you need a calculator to take a calc test, that's bad."
Posts: 44 | Registered: Tuesday, May 25 2004 07:00
Warrior
Member # 4484
Profile #19
Can't it be something like "Galactic Core 2" :D ?!
You want SF game, they've done it!

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Discworld, The Colour of Magic
Posts: 178 | Registered: Monday, June 7 2004 07:00
Law Bringer
Member # 335
Profile Homepage #20
There's always the faint hope that A4 will not follow A3 chronologically. The story of the the discovery and exploration of Exile or even the story of the Empire's expansion would give him more room for plot and less room to tread on the toes of those who have continued the story of Ermarian already. Yes, there are also those who have created the backstory, but I think it would be the lesser evil.

Heck, it could be the story of vahnatai a few millenia before A1-3 or a few millenia later. Then everyone demanding vahnatai PCs will be happy too.

—Alorael, who doesn't think this will actually happen. He just needs to point out that it's a possibility. Maybe, just maybe, the vahnatai are so popular that Jeff will focus on them instead of on yet more Empire and Avernum shenanigans.
Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00
BoE Posse
Member # 112
Profile #21
It'll almost certainly be A4.

To be honest, I don't see how it would be such an act of contempt for the community. But then, I never particularly cared for the Exile/Avernum storyline in the first place.

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Posts: 1423 | Registered: Sunday, October 7 2001 07:00
Shake Before Using
Member # 75
Profile #22
If it's A4, it'd be nice if it actually fleshed out some official backstory. Including, like, geography and such. But meh.
Posts: 3234 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00
Warrior
Member # 3340
Profile #23
My guess is Nethergate 2.

Why?

Ask yourself this:

where did Sylak and all the other sidhe went???

James

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Sometimes I just don't know anything about everything -- or do I ?
Posts: 99 | Registered: Wednesday, August 13 2003 07:00
Apprentice
Member # 4112
Profile #24
N2+A4 in one game?
fx: thinks

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