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3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 12:59 Profile #19
quote:
Originally written by Dastal:

KernelKnowledge, if it's such an easy process, and you have already figured it out, you should have no problem quickly converting the Mac 3D BoA editor to Windows.
I never said it was easy. I screwed around with the original editor for a month over the summer and started working on a 3D editor using MFC/DirectX. (Before I started thinking cross-platform.) After a little I got an idea for a project that could potentially make me some money, so I dumped the editor.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 10:27 Profile #16
quote:
Originally written by Khothie:

Actually, I think the parts of the editor dealing with the file format are the nastiest and most arcane parts, with the possible exception of the script parsing.
The saving and loading functions (for scenario files) are very simple, and its pretty easy to see how the files are stored:

Scenario Info Struct (Can't remember the real name)
Outdoor Sections
Towns (the size of each town differs based on the stored town size)

The editor's scripting functions are total and utter crap, but a more extensive one isn't neccessarily needed.

quote:
Originally written by Khothie:

There is some weird magic for dealing with endian-ness that I don't want to touch with a bargepole, for a start.
I think you're talking about the flipShort function. All it does is switch the two bytes contained in the given short. The following function would probably be better, if somewhat slower:

template< class _Ty >
_Ty& flipData( _Ty& d)
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 10:27 Profile #16
quote:
Originally written by Khothie:

Actually, I think the parts of the editor dealing with the file format are the nastiest and most arcane parts, with the possible exception of the script parsing.
The saving and loading functions (for scenario files) are very simple, and its pretty easy to see how the files are stored:

Scenario Info Struct (Can't remember the real name)
Outdoor Sections
Towns (the size of each town differs based on the stored town size)

The editor's scripting functions are total and utter crap, but a more extensive one isn't neccessarily needed.

quote:
Originally written by Khothie:

There is some weird magic for dealing with endian-ness that I don't want to touch with a bargepole, for a start.
I think you're talking about the flipShort function. All it does is switch the two bytes contained in the given short. The following function would probably be better, if somewhat slower:

template< class _Ty >
_Ty& flipData( _Ty& d)
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 10:01 Profile #14
The scenario-saving parts are extremely simple. Only the several simple classes (located I believe in global.h) in Jeff's code need to be copied and screwed with.

There is a scripting engine ( technically an engine) that loads the editor's global data (from the corescendata.txt files) that should not be copied. A quick lexer and parser should be created using the Script Checking program's grammar files, with FLEX++ and Bison++. The Bison++ input file should be tweaked to actually edit a ScenData object.

The graphical interface should use OpenGL, if it's meant to be fast. (An easier alternative, however, would be just to use a toolkit's graphical classes.) Using OpenGL would allow for shaders and therefore more flexible tinting code, but would take much longer to implement.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 10:01 Profile #14
The scenario-saving parts are extremely simple. Only the several simple classes (located I believe in global.h) in Jeff's code need to be copied and screwed with.

There is a scripting engine ( technically an engine) that loads the editor's global data (from the corescendata.txt files) that should not be copied. A quick lexer and parser should be created using the Script Checking program's grammar files, with FLEX++ and Bison++. The Bison++ input file should be tweaked to actually edit a ScenData object.

The graphical interface should use OpenGL, if it's meant to be fast. (An easier alternative, however, would be just to use a toolkit's graphical classes.) Using OpenGL would allow for shaders and therefore more flexible tinting code, but would take much longer to implement.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 08:49 Profile #12
It would be rather difficult. Fortunately there are several libraries that would make it easier (wxWidgets, Boost, WideStudio, the famous STL and its many add-ons). Also much of file handling/scripting code can be copied and tweaked to favor a more object oriented approach.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 08:49 Profile #12
It would be rather difficult. Fortunately there are several libraries that would make it easier (wxWidgets, Boost, WideStudio, the famous STL and its many add-ons). Also much of file handling/scripting code can be copied and tweaked to favor a more object oriented approach.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
OK, folks, looks like I can port my tools to a Mac... in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 07:42 Profile #4
quote:
Originally written by Walker, Texas Corpse:

Why not use a cross-platform toolkit like wxWidgets that works in a decent language? Then you wouldn't have to port anything.

(Don't make your software suck just to port it to the Mac.)
People are starting to catch on. ;)
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
OK, folks, looks like I can port my tools to a Mac... in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 07:42 Profile #4
quote:
Originally written by Walker, Texas Corpse:

Why not use a cross-platform toolkit like wxWidgets that works in a decent language? Then you wouldn't have to port anything.

(Don't make your software suck just to port it to the Mac.)
People are starting to catch on. ;)
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 07:36 Profile #10
quote:
Originally written by Mortimer:

Possibly because I don't believe he has a PC available to test it on.
Hence the term, cross-platform library. If he uses one and it works on a Mac, it should work on any platform the library supports. He'd just have to get it to a PC to build the executable, which shouldn't be too hard considering the amount of programmers in this community.

quote:
Originally written by Mortimer:

Arenax's current projects sound far more interesting to me as well, I haven't had much problem with the 2D editor, a 3D one is just a nice want rather then a need.
A need would be an editor (3D or not) with plugin capabilities for the various smaller programs people are working on.

quote:
Originally written by Arenax:

Because Jeff's code, to be very frank, sucks. Graphics are handled entirely differently and the mechanism for putting them on the screen is weird on a Mac.
Of course it sucks. It's complicated and entirely too messy, but getting the gist of it isn't too hard, if you look at the right parts. Ignore the Mac graphic's code; it shouldn't matter. Look at how the program itself loads, and then the format of the scenario files.

[ Thursday, November 18, 2004 07:40: Message edited by: KernelKnowledge12 ]
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Thursday, November 18 2004 07:36 Profile #10
quote:
Originally written by Mortimer:

Possibly because I don't believe he has a PC available to test it on.
Hence the term, cross-platform library. If he uses one and it works on a Mac, it should work on any platform the library supports. He'd just have to get it to a PC to build the executable, which shouldn't be too hard considering the amount of programmers in this community.

quote:
Originally written by Mortimer:

Arenax's current projects sound far more interesting to me as well, I haven't had much problem with the 2D editor, a 3D one is just a nice want rather then a need.
A need would be an editor (3D or not) with plugin capabilities for the various smaller programs people are working on.

quote:
Originally written by Arenax:

Because Jeff's code, to be very frank, sucks. Graphics are handled entirely differently and the mechanism for putting them on the screen is weird on a Mac.
Of course it sucks. It's complicated and entirely too messy, but getting the gist of it isn't too hard, if you look at the right parts. Ignore the Mac graphic's code; it shouldn't matter. Look at how the program itself loads, and then the format of the scenario files.

[ Thursday, November 18, 2004 07:40: Message edited by: KernelKnowledge12 ]
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Wednesday, November 17 2004 11:42 Profile #7
Why not just get the maker of the Mac 3D Editor to port his own/Jeff's code using a free cross-platform class library?
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
3D BOA Editor (Windows) in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Wednesday, November 17 2004 11:42 Profile #7
Why not just get the maker of the Mac 3D Editor to port his own/Jeff's code using a free cross-platform class library?
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
Scenario File Format in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Tuesday, November 2 2004 11:45 Profile #27
quote:
Originally written by +t:

At last something more valuable, than senseless talks about law(s)!
What people do on their own time (stupid, pointless and illegal or otherwise) is none of my concern.
quote:
Originally written by +t:

But well i'll not use that library. I reckon that what I'll gain from it will be much less that I'll spend...
The wxWidgets framework is free.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
Scenario File Format in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Tuesday, November 2 2004 11:45 Profile #27
quote:
Originally written by +t:

At last something more valuable, than senseless talks about law(s)!
What people do on their own time (stupid, pointless and illegal or otherwise) is none of my concern.
quote:
Originally written by +t:

But well i'll not use that library. I reckon that what I'll gain from it will be much less that I'll spend...
The wxWidgets framework is free.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
Scenario File Format in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Monday, November 1 2004 07:25 Profile #15
quote:
Originally written by +t:


2. Using that specification, I'll make my own BoA Editor for Windows.
If you do plan on making your own BoA Editor, please consider using the wxWidgets (fromerly wxWindows) framework to power your application, as it is an incredibly comprehensive, cross platform UI.

[ Monday, November 01, 2004 07:28: Message edited by: KernelKnowledge12 ]
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
Scenario File Format in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Monday, November 1 2004 07:25 Profile #15
quote:
Originally written by +t:


2. Using that specification, I'll make my own BoA Editor for Windows.
If you do plan on making your own BoA Editor, please consider using the wxWidgets (fromerly wxWindows) framework to power your application, as it is an incredibly comprehensive, cross platform UI.

[ Monday, November 01, 2004 07:28: Message edited by: KernelKnowledge12 ]
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
Adding custom items in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Wednesday, August 25 2004 07:34 Profile #2
You should also make sure the icon adjust variable is set to the correct value.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
Adding custom items in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Wednesday, August 25 2004 07:34 Profile #2
You should also make sure the icon adjust variable is set to the correct value.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
Script checking program in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Friday, August 20 2004 04:32 Profile #8
I added an extra semicolon to the "clear" statement at the beginning of scenario data script, and got about thousands of "structural errors" on almost every line. This has to be an error.

I am using the Windows version.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
Script checking program in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Friday, August 20 2004 04:32 Profile #8
I added an extra semicolon to the "clear" statement at the beginning of scenario data script, and got about thousands of "structural errors" on almost every line. This has to be an error.

I am using the Windows version.
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
BoA Editor Suggestions in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Friday, August 6 2004 05:56 Profile #42
My sentiments exactly. :)
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
BoA Editor Suggestions in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Friday, August 6 2004 05:56 Profile #42
My sentiments exactly. :)
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
BoA Editor Suggestions in Blades of Avernum Editor
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Friday, August 6 2004 04:03 Profile #40
the set_up_lights function itself is relatively short, and shouldn't be too hard to include into the engine (although it would be a performance dampener when called by Avernum Script). But it shouldn't be too hard to put in auxillary functions that recalculate lighting for certain terrain spots and maybe rectangles. This however could be too annoying for someone who would tends to use this function alot (whoever that may be), so Jeff would have to put in an auto check for it whenever the lighting array may have been comprimised by a terrain change or whatever. There can then be two more functions that enable and disable auto lighting, which again shouldn't be to0 hard.

[ Friday, August 06, 2004 04:05: Message edited by: KernelKnowledge12 ]
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00
BoA Editor Suggestions in Blades of Avernum
KernelKnowledge12
Shock Trooper
Member # 4557
 written Friday, August 6 2004 04:03 Profile #40
the set_up_lights function itself is relatively short, and shouldn't be too hard to include into the engine (although it would be a performance dampener when called by Avernum Script). But it shouldn't be too hard to put in auxillary functions that recalculate lighting for certain terrain spots and maybe rectangles. This however could be too annoying for someone who would tends to use this function alot (whoever that may be), so Jeff would have to put in an auto check for it whenever the lighting array may have been comprimised by a terrain change or whatever. There can then be two more functions that enable and disable auto lighting, which again shouldn't be to0 hard.

[ Friday, August 06, 2004 04:05: Message edited by: KernelKnowledge12 ]
Posts: 264 | Registered: Wednesday, June 16 2004 07:00

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