Family Entertainment / Distribution
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Shock Trooper
Member # 1973
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written Friday, October 18 2002 09:25
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Okay, I've been roughing out some stories in my head, with the intention of using them as Blades of Avernum scenarios. This led me to wonder about Spiderweb Software's official stance on profanity and obscenity in user-created scenarios, which led me further to wonder about their position on other areas which are on the borderline of free speech, such as pornography and hate speech. Let me just say right now that I'm not planning on making any scenarios advocating bigotry in any way, but it's not inconceivable that a story might call for a villain or gray-area character who holds views which I find reprehensible. Spiderweb games do actually have a precedent for this, as one of their common themes seems to be discrimination. Using metaphors (Sliths and Nephilim, for example) is definitely one way to deal with it. A3 features at least three homosexual NPCs in the demo, and they don't seem to be discriminated against in any way, but what if a scenario involved a homophobic character? Likewise, I'm not likely to create a scenario featuring anything graphic, but a plot may call for full or partial nudity. How would that sit with Spiderweb? And, getting back to the language issue, not everybody uses language appropriate to children. From experience, I can tell you that soldiers, laborers, and drinkers have a tendency to say things that wouldn't necessarily be suitable for all audiences. I will be strongly tempted to recreate that aspect of humanity in any scenario I write. Obviously dialog won't be completely offensive, but from time to time, we all encounter people with salty language. I know. I'm one of them. Wondering about all this got me wondering about distribution. Are there scenario servers? Are they owned, operated, and/or regulated by Spiderweb? If I create a scenario that Spiderweb doesn't or wouldn't approve of for whatever reason and make it available for download from my own domain, will that be a problem? Would I be expected to include disclaimers, and at what point would that be necessary? Any thoughts or responses would be helpful, or at the very least, interesting. Posts: 319 | Registered: Monday, September 30 2002 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Friday, October 18 2002 10:47
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If this works like BoE, Spiderweb will host scenarios pretty much without checking content. Unless something is created as a medium for a message of prejudice or pure pornography, it's probably okay. There are scenario ratings you can choose, so strong language and other minor problems can be covered by rating a scenario R. There's also an NC-17 option for anything really questionable, but I can't think of any scenario that would require the rating and be worth playing. —Alorael, who also is fairly sure that there will be other sites hosting scenarios, just as the Lyceum and other sites host scenarios for BoE. And, if worst comes to worst and everyone hates your scenario, you can usually find some site and host it yourself. Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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Triad Mage
Member # 7
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written Friday, October 18 2002 13:55
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Pornography is prohibited in scenarios. Language is not an issue at all. Racial and sexual issues, if directed at Sliths, Nephils, or any in-game race seems fine, just so long as you don't single out black humans or anything like that. -------------------- "At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander ==== Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet ==== You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse! Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Friday, October 18 2002 15:34
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Perhaps I'm wrong, but I think you could even throw in humans who discriminate against other human groups (although it would be safer and more political correct to choose imaginary groups) as long as you don't force the player to take that view. —Alorael, who would generally assume that anything is okay as long as it furthers the plot and isn't created solely for its own sake. And if you're relying on shock for a plot, your scenario isn't worth its disk space. Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 1863
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written Friday, October 18 2002 18:44
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Check out the section on R rated scenarios in Blades of Exile articles and examples. It's a good discussion on this subject. -------------------- Fnord. (Insert your name here) is a capitalist pigdog. Deus Ex Penguin: God out of the Penguin......Cogito Eggo Sum: I think, waffle I am. If Voting could change the system, it would be against the law. Posts: 298 | Registered: Tuesday, September 10 2002 07:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 20
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written Saturday, October 19 2002 08:17
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I think most perfectly good scenarios could be made BETTER by having a lot of pictures of naked women :/ Posts: 191 | Registered: Monday, October 1 2001 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 32
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written Saturday, October 19 2002 08:22
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How would that benefit to the scenarios themselves? It is a bad sign if you have to show pornographic images in order to keep players interested in your scenario. [ Saturday, October 19, 2002 08:25: Message edited by: Lt. Sullust ] -------------------- Lt. Sullust Cogito Ergo Sum Polaris Posts: 2462 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 20
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written Saturday, October 19 2002 08:36
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Ok let's take movies for example. Imagine a perfectly good movie. Nothing wrong with it in the world. Now imagine the EXACT same movie except all of the attractive young women have no clothes! It would be an enhancement, not the main feature. The plot, characters, etc would all still be the focus, but yuo would also have some naked titties to stare at. Posts: 191 | Registered: Monday, October 1 2001 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Saturday, October 19 2002 13:26
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I think this thread needs to end now. Quickly. —Alorael, who lacks the authority to lock it. So he'll just say that the conversation needs to change. Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 1829
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written Saturday, October 19 2002 13:30
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quote:It would not actually enhance the movie, as the nudity would make people focus less on the plot and more on the nudity. It's actually been proven that people can usually more coherently tell what the plot is in a movie without nudity then one with, in the latter case most people in fact were more likely to remember the nudity then the actual plot. Posts: 206 | Registered: Tuesday, September 3 2002 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 1973
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written Saturday, October 19 2002 13:41
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Nudity isn't totally without its place. The mere presence of nudity doesn't automatically transform a work into pornography. Your "proven" fact, Squeaky, sounds suspect to me. When I was twelve, that was probably true for me, but as an adult, it is far from the case. Perhaps I am desensetised from working in the internet porn biz, but I would like to think that most intelligent adults don't simply turn into gibbering idiots when they see a picture of a nipple. Posts: 319 | Registered: Monday, September 30 2002 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Saturday, October 19 2002 14:41
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Porn is not physically or mentally harmful, and those who think it is morally wrong can avoid it. Thus, there is nothing wrong with it in a totally impartial light. That being said, it shouldn't be discussed here, or anywhere on these boards. This topic really needs to end. —Alorael, who cannot think of any way to gracefully work nudity into Avernum graphics. They are fairly small... Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 20
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written Saturday, October 19 2002 14:57
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:rolls eyes: Has the boards been taken over fundamentalists while I was gone? Sheesh. If you prejudge someone who works in the porn industry then you are, simply, a weakminded fool. Posts: 191 | Registered: Monday, October 1 2001 07:00 |
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BANNED
Member # 4
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written Saturday, October 19 2002 15:13
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Aruneko, I have serious problems with you, already. That was an idiotic, stupid, degrading, and outright false remark. Don't do it. Again. ---- And to deal with the subject at hand, well, nudity is an "only if necessary" thing. If a scenario requires nudity for certain scenes, for the love of the children, rate the scenario R, or NC-17. Racial slurs; however, I'm okay with- as long as they don't promote them. It's perfectly fine to have your villain be a group of Klu-klux like people, woven thick with ignorance. Just don't make those kluxers the good guys. Ever. If you *are* going to make a scenario like that, it is thouroughly reccomended that you warn the player about this in the readme, and intro text. Many people will view BoE as a gaming paradigm, where the laws of reality are void. Please account for them. -------------------- * Posts: 6936 | Registered: Tuesday, September 18 2001 07:00 |