The U.S. and Iraq
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Agent
Member # 8030
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written Tuesday, March 27 2007 17:01
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quote:I knew someone would say that. The internet can't really be trusted, and credibility can only be proven through absolute proof. That's the disadvantage of not talking to people in person, you can't actually tell their honesty. I could say that I'm honest, but that would only contradict the sarcastically stated fact that Thuryl said. But in all reality, we seem to believe strings of text posted on the internet. To make it simple, credibility is a rather strange concept. -------------------- WWJD? Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Tuesday, March 27 2007 17:34
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That's not really the point, though. You've provided no evidence whatsoever. You might want at least to give a source. -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 8030
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written Tuesday, March 27 2007 17:44
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quote:I did say that, I'm sure of it. That's an explanations for not having any sources you can easily view. -------------------- WWJD? Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Tuesday, March 27 2007 18:05
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I didn't say "links." I said "sources." I'm assuming that this is not your own original research; you heard this somewhere. At least provide some reference to where you heard it. -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 8030
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written Tuesday, March 27 2007 18:07
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quote:Does that answer your question? -------------------- WWJD? Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Tuesday, March 27 2007 18:31
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You read them personally? If so, whose exactly, and where did you get them? [ Tuesday, March 27, 2007 18:33: Message edited by: Malakos the Freshly-Plowed ] -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Tuesday, March 27 2007 18:37
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quote:I find this very suspicious. —Alorael, who has it on the very best of authority that Bush has pesronally murdered kittens and spoken disparagingly of your mother. Dante says so! Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Tuesday, March 27 2007 19:35
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Wow. Is there a test range for nuclear devices out near where you live in Nevada, Excalibur? Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |
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? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
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written Tuesday, March 27 2007 20:15
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Only 50 miles up wind. But our sources say that there is not going to be a problem with the testing . -------------------- quote: Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |
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Canned
Member # 7704
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 06:30
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Lies, only lies. We cannot see the truth because they have taken our eyes . They are silencing us but one time we shall rise up against the shadows. THE GOVERNMENTS are WATCHING US . Internet is being surveyed : people that speak against them are crushed. Because we are not united. They have the power to manipulate information so they will do it. Internet is ling to us because Random people feed the internet causing a flood of ideas therefore governments see our deepest intimate thoughts and our concerns. The guy who made the internet made it probably for that reason. But the people trying to destroy governments are more dangerous than governments themselves. Terrorist do exist not in the form of muslim bombers but in the form of people saying that governments are wrong and take action against the brutal forces that are here to protect us. See the irony? I tried to say so in my topics about government conspiracies but i didn't make understandable so that people could understand I'm sorry about my behavior surely i am. I have difficulties with communication and socializing. [ Wednesday, March 28, 2007 06:34: Message edited by: upon mars ] -------------------- You can jump off a bridge, fire a gun in your mouth, drink poison,or going in to the tiger's pit but you will still end up dead it's a mater of time and how . Posts: 312 | Registered: Sunday, November 26 2006 08:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 08:52
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Don't mistake for malice what is more easily explained by incompetence. The government created the internet for the sake of policing our thoughts? Please. The proliferation of internet porn belies that assertion. Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |
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? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 09:04
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quote:I assure you that we are still studying the situation. :eek: -------------------- quote: Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 8338
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 09:52
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quote:There's nothing "strange" about crediblity. Also, you have it wrong. It's not how "honest" or "credible" a person sounds that makes their information true, it's how good their sources are. Even if you met some of us in real life you could still be lied to if you didn't do any of your own research into the situation. That said, please excuse me while I saunter off to kick the person who started this thread in their virtual groin. Posts: 85 | Registered: Sunday, March 18 2007 07:00 |
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Lifecrafter
Member # 6388
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 11:12
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quote:http://www.snopes.com/politics/clintons/bodycount.asp quote:Clinton was involved in the Waco incident in exactly the capacity you describe: head of the executive branch, which presided over the FBI efforts to arrest the leader - a white supremacist cult leader sitting on a stockpile of small arms large enough to arm a small division. For the record, the decision that lead to the accidental fire was Janet Reno's, not Bill Clinton's. But she was right to make that decision, tragic as the consequences of it might have been. The problem with Clinton-mania is lacuna like that in the public memory. Waco wasn't FBI oppression and murder; Waco was a bunch of extremely well-armed white-supremacist lunatics being so intransigent in refusing to cooperate with the authorities that force was required. There was a fire - by accident - because of that use of force. While it's unfortunate a fire broke out and people were killed, chances are a cult as heavily-armed and basically evil in their beliefs as the Branch Davidians holed up in an area of Texas basically surrounded by potential victims - the Mexican-American citizens of backwater Texas - would have been extremely dangerous if force hadn't been used to dislodge them. It's one of those unfortunate cases where the government really didn't have any good choices and simply went with the best of the bad ones. [ Wednesday, March 28, 2007 11:13: Message edited by: Protocols of the Elders of Zion ] Posts: 794 | Registered: Tuesday, October 11 2005 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 8030
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 13:15
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If Waco was just an accident, how come the FBI used incineary bombs? quote:That's what the government wants you to believe, and they've done that well. It's sad to see how people are so easily brainwashed. The Branch Davidians had strange theology, but they weren't white-supremeists nor were they heavily armed (but the FBI was). Waco was a failed attempt by the government to cover things up. quote:I haven't actually seen them myself, but I know people who have. I'd like to read them someday, but it's hard to get into government records. My father knows a guy who has photocopies, but can't remeber his name (I'll post it as soon as I get his name from my father). quote:That test site is many miles away in southern Nevada; I live in northern Nevada. [ Wednesday, March 28, 2007 13:16: Message edited by: Excalibur ] -------------------- WWJD? Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00 |
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? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 14:05
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quote:Please explain how a school kid sussed* this? * discovered [ Wednesday, March 28, 2007 14:22: Message edited by: Spent Salmon ] -------------------- quote: Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 8030
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 14:07
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What does sussed mean? [ Wednesday, March 28, 2007 14:08: Message edited by: Excalibur ] -------------------- WWJD? Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 18:26
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Actually, it's pretty easy to get into government records - it's called the Freedom of Information Act. Maybe it's just hard if you live out in Nevada and take the KKKoolaid drinkers at their word. Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |
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Lifecrafter
Member # 6388
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 19:54
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quote:They didn't. A tear agent was used. An unusually violent tear agent, but just a tear agent. While that would usually be somewhat implausible, do bear in mind the Branch Davidians had several tons of ammunition lying around the place, along with large amounts of fuel and other inflammables. Given the situation, in fact, an incindiary would have been implausible: using one would have resulted in a tremendous explosion as most of the ammunition and flammables went off at once, not a gradual burn as a small fire gradually spread as ammo cooked and gas flashed. quote:The BDs weren't heavily armed? Bull: They opened fire when the ATF came knocking, taking four lives. Records exist, as reliable as any that exist for anything, that almost $200,000 worth of weapons were purchased by the BDs - numbering 131 in total. The source I've referred to also documents tapes recording Kopesh discussing using fire as a defensive tactic, along with 'spreading fuel'. quote:Read the Snopes link. Also, there was a cottage industry for producing extremely tenuous 'evidence' that Clinton presided over a massive conspiracy to butcher a million people or whatever during the 90s. He couldn't cover up half a dozen blow jobs with an intern, who all but sign a contract to be discreet walking orifices; how exactly was he supposed to orchestrate what would have been the single biggest coverup in human history? Exercise a little more skepticism. The 'Clinton murdered X people', unless you have a very flexible definition of 'murdered' and are referring to either Kosovo or Iraq (or his massive cut in welfare benefits, although Ginrich can claim partial credit for that), is an extremely bold claim that requires extremely good evidence. An affadavit a friend of your father swears up and down to have seen from someone who swears up and down that Clinton did something nasty doesn't cut it. The public record is pretty consistent on what Clinton did and didn't do, because he was President and the President can barely fart without it going on seven forms of documentation. Ken Starr, who spent most of the 90s trying to ruin Clinton on the flimsiest evidence imaginable, acknowledges he didn't kill anyone. And first and foremost, think of Nixon. Spywork hasn't advanced by a whole hell of a lot since then, and he couldn't redact 13 minutes of videotape without creating suspicion big enough to virtually impeach him - and that's over something as small as a videotape. Kill a hundred people over the course of eight years and hide it? In any modern beaureaucratic state, absolutely impossible. Like sneaking a nuke into Fort Knox. I don't like Clinton either, but I have more solid reasons for not liking him than conspiracy theories. He sold the Democrats out, and as a consequence of that we have an idiot like the Shrub running the country with an iron fist. quote:He's right; technically, the test site is closer to me than to him. :P [ Wednesday, March 28, 2007 19:56: Message edited by: Protocols of the Elders of Zion ] Posts: 794 | Registered: Tuesday, October 11 2005 07:00 |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 22:56
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quote:Snopes is clearly a branch of the US government.  -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
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Lifecrafter
Member # 6388
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written Wednesday, March 28 2007 23:14
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Disregarding his capacity to think critically is rude, Thuryl. We all come to incorrect conclusions; what matters is whether we are willing to reverse them. :P Posts: 794 | Registered: Tuesday, October 11 2005 07:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Thursday, March 29 2007 01:50
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Bill Clinton's presidency was a ploy to distract attention from his murder spree; but that's nothing. The American Revolution let George Washington get away with selling watered rum for decades. Lincoln's secret was fake hickory veneer. -------------------- We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 8030
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written Thursday, March 29 2007 10:54
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This is a long post, but shows my sources. As far as the incineary bombs go; the video proves they used them, and one officer there admitted during an interview that he was ordered to order incineary bombs. quote:The man's name is Glen Stoll (might me mispelled) and he was the person who interviewed the officer I mentioned earlier. Wikipedia quote:Very, Very, suspicious. quote:So what are they hiding? quote:Wikipedia doesn't get their stuff from nowhere quote:Koresh didn't really have power over them then, so why didn't they leave. quote:So you believe false testimony? quote:So these grenades just appeared there? quote:Again, use of incindeary devices. Where are you getting this from, Protocols. quote:The FBI lying, again. Wikipedia, of course, has many sources. The Massacre of the Branch Davidians If I were going to quote everything in there supporting my side of the arguement, these post would be many pages long. The individual who wrote this has hundreds of sources, enough to get the point through WACO: The Inside Story PBS had access to secret government documents for that episode of Frontline. Branch Davidians You should scroll down to the section titled "Lawsuits Against Government" I found this stuff by doing a google search for "Branch Davidians." I found even more stuff, but didn't bother to post it here. [ Thursday, March 29, 2007 10:56: Message edited by: Excalibur ] -------------------- WWJD? Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 8406
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written Thursday, March 29 2007 11:02
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quote:God bless America. Posts: 47 | Registered: Thursday, March 29 2007 07:00 |
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? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
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written Thursday, March 29 2007 11:07
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If I was in charge, rather than Janet Reno, I wouldn't have bothered issuing a warrant. I would have borrowed a 120mm cannon from the Navy and done target practice. I still fail to see your purpose. Really. Even if what you have read is true, how do you, as an individual, gain from this knowledge? What part of it makes you a better person? Is it something you can use to increase your lot in life? I fear you haven't thought this through, and are fanatically following some line of dogmatic reasoning purely for the sake of feeling that you are right, they are wrong, and the world isn't fair. That, my young friend, is exactly the type of training used in Afghanistan in terrorist training camps. -------------------- quote: Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |