ACS - TNG

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AuthorTopic: ACS - TNG
? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
Profile #0
The upcoming release of Avernum 5 is sort of bittersweet for this long-time SW fan. Jeff will be making two more games in his known worlds, and then he will be starting fresh. From what I've read, this means he doesn't even know if he will be doing the isometric thing at all. It will be kind of weird to see something change so drastically, but I guess one can just look back to '99 or whenever his Exile ended to see the beginnings of his constant change.

So, since you are (presumably) here for the current set of worlds, and are anticipating the next world, what would you like to see? I see the Exile/Avernum world as magic friendly, with a great deal of fighting and not many other methods of persuasion. The Geneforge world is more strategic, but has the persuasive powers of magic, and isn't fighting centric. Both are located in places which are contained geographically, with Avernum being subterranean (mostly) and Geneforge taking place on islands/valleys.

So, what would it be? If you could make the broad strokes, what would the next generation become?

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Synergy, et al - "I don't get it."

Argon - "I'm at a loss for words..."
Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00
Shaper
Member # 7420
Profile Homepage #1
I wouldn't mind a science fiction world with no magic. Most science fiction RPGs have horrible plots to begin with and I think Jeff could do better. His two series both hinged on a single unique theme (cave world; shaping). I would be interested to see what unique perspective he could add to the science fiction genre.

But didn't Jeff say something recently about revisiting the Exile series? Again?

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You lose.
Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00
Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
Profile #2
Jeff has said that he intends to keep his cave world alive indefinitely by keeping the older games playable on new machines, and perhaps with periodic 'Resurrection' style remakes. But I think his plan is to start something new after A6.

I think sci-fi would be cool, too. Geneforge could have been sci-fi with minimal tweaking, really. It's plots and themes are in many ways more like sci-fi than traditional fantasy, anyway. So a rather free, Arthur C. Clarkesque sci-fi could probably work well.

I don't think I want to see gritty post-apocalyptic stuff set on Earth. It's not escapist enough. Post-apocalyptic on some distant far future colony world would be okay, since that would leave many more options open for just what could have happened or might happen next.

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Listen carefully because some of your options may have changed.
Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00
Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
Profile Homepage #3
Geneforge was originally going to be pure sci-fi, I believe, but Jeff changed to it a fantasy-esque hybrid because he was worried about the commercial credibility of a game without swords or spells.

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"Slartucker is going to have a cow when he hears about this," Synergy said.
Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00
Law Bringer
Member # 2984
Profile Homepage #4
Gritty historical fiction, in various ancient real-world settings. Like Nethergate with a bit less Faerie, but not devoid of mysticism/alchemy. I believe it was Alec who said that Steampunk sadly lacks good non-Eurocentric stories; if there's someone I'd like to see try that, it'd be Jeff.

Or Sci-Fi. With strategical elements added in. Perhaps something on the order of Escape Velocity, but sans the monotonous cargo-running missions and with "Show, Don't Tell" - the story would be a bit more lively than a series of dialogue boxes.

Finally, I'll say something controversial. I don't think the Geneforge concept is inherently bad. It has arguably suffered by only being fully fleshed out after what we might call the "dumbing down" of SW games. Exile was pretty high-brow, echoing the last shreds of an era when a lot of gamers were actually programmers. As we examine the development from then to now, some people blame Jeff for abandoning this early market, but what we need to acknowledge is that (concurrent with Eternal September) this is a symptom of computers becoming generally available to a larger and less high-brow audience.

So while we're listing wishes we know have no prayer anyway, please let me add a desire to see Jeff turn out another game for literate people as opposed to the near-proverbial nine-year-old Pokemon collector.
Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00
Infiltrator
Member # 4248
Profile #5
Hey, there's nothing wrong with Pokemon! *grumble*

I personally would like to see space adventure somewhat in the vein of Star Control 2. I'd like to see what Jeff can squeeze out of the theme of first contact!

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Life is a neverending carneval where everyone has multiple costumes. I just hope mine are pleasing to the eye.
Posts: 617 | Registered: Tuesday, April 13 2004 07:00
? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
Profile #6
I too would like to see a tech based CRPG, but in a tech-starved environment. Maybe a colony which is bereft of contact with the outer world. Something with a clear goal, like repair of a starship, or perhaps discovery of the same.

At the same time, like Aran and perhaps others, I would also like to see a Mayan or perhaps Incan Nethergate. And a Wild West game might be fun too, but it should probably be in the style of Firefly.

Man, that show was awesome.

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Synergy, et al - "I don't get it."

Argon - "I'm at a loss for words..."
Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00
Agent
Member # 4574
Profile #7
Something historically based would be nice. I'm thinking the Days of Empire and Colonization. It could even be a series. First stop: India, with the mighty and magical Mughal Empire working with the Europeans for trade, and the Europeans competing with each other, most notably the British and Dutch.

Then, the West Indies. There's a slave revolt in Jamaica, that's threatening to spread to the rest of the Caribbean. Meanwhile, the threat of war with Spain lingers, and the Queen has issued privateers to upset the Spanish Gold Fleets. Then, as a colonist on the frontier, you have to struggle to keep other empires from encroaching on your territory.

A similar themed American episode can happen as well, with the Amerindians, Canadians, Loyalists, Rebels, and Slaves all getting their own spotlight. You're a rebel soldier out in the wilderness somewhere, near the Canadian border. Slaves are trying to escape into freedom to the west, Canadian forces are constantly attacking, the Amerindians are fighting against you, and now the Loyalists are trying to coax you into joining the Brits.

And just think of the treasure trove that the Scramble for Africa would bring.

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"I'm happy I'm the mentally disturbed person I am." -Nioca
"Yes, Iffy is a demon." -Iffy
"To fly, throw yourself at the ground and miss." -The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
Posts: 1186 | Registered: Friday, June 18 2004 07:00
Agent
Member # 8030
Profile Homepage #8
I'd like to see a remake of the 80's game Omega.

I doubt Jeff would consider science fiction, as doing so would result in a demand for graphics. Additionally, I think he's grown fond of swordplay worlds.

Edit: The completion of A6 and G5 could possibly take two years.

[ Monday, January 21, 2008 09:26: Message edited by: Excalibur ]

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set_name(1,"Excalibur");
Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00
Law Bringer
Member # 6785
Profile #9
I'll go with something Delicious Vlish proposed a martial arts themed game. Something along the lines of the Monastary of Madness from Exile/Avernum 3 in combat style with less magic than most of the games. Unarmed combat could dominate along with all those bad movie inside joke references.

Otherwise a sci-fi theme where puzzles returned where some thinking is involved.
Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00
Agent
Member # 2759
Profile Homepage #10
I don't have any fixed ideas; whatever he does I'll buy it, if it's as good as Geneforge 4 and Avernum 5, or indeed the original Geneforge.

My preference would be for something fantasy-based, but not in the swords & sorcery style. Hmmm, superheroes seem to be popular nowadays. Maybe not, but you could do something unreality-based without magic, or it being sci-fi.

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Geneforge 4 stuff. Also, everything I know about Avernum | Avernum 2 | Avernum 3 | Avernum 4
Posts: 1104 | Registered: Monday, March 10 2003 08:00
Law Bringer
Member # 335
Profile Homepage #11
I think the concept behind A2's Dark Waters and Za-Khazi could be expanded into a full game. Fantasy, sci-fi, or anything else, aloneness, exploration and survival are good things. It even works well in a post-apocalyptic setting.

—Alorael, who also thinks that another A1 style huge open area available from the beginning could go well. It won't happen, but that style of open-ended world exploration is nice and sets the stage well for a series based on the world.
Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00
Agent
Member # 4574
Profile #12
quote:
Originally written by Sleepnir:

I think the concept behind A2's Dark Waters and Za-Khazi could be expanded into a full game. Fantasy, sci-fi, or anything else, aloneness, exploration and survival are good things. It even works well in a post-apocalyptic setting.

—Alorael, who also thinks that another A1 style huge open area available from the beginning could go well. It won't happen, but that style of open-ended world exploration is nice and sets the stage well for a series based on the world.

Yes. Both of those were wonderful... But it would be difficult to make a whole game out of those sorts of things. I can only, effectively, think of a single sequel that could result from such a thing, and that would be leading colonisation efforts into the lands that you discovered.

But still, the concept was great. I would love it if Jeff incorporated more things like that into his games.

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"I'm happy I'm the mentally disturbed person I am." -Nioca
"Yes, Iffy is a demon." -Iffy
"To fly, throw yourself at the ground and miss." -The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
Posts: 1186 | Registered: Friday, June 18 2004 07:00
Law Bringer
Member # 2984
Profile Homepage #13
quote:
There's a slave revolt in Jamaica, that's threatening to spread to the rest of the Caribbean. Meanwhile, the threat of war with Spain lingers, and the Queen has issued privateers to upset the Spanish Gold Fleets. Then, as a colonist on the frontier, you have to struggle to keep other empires from encroaching on your territory.
He's a PIRATE!

If only that phrase had attained the same renown "This is SPARTA" has. Even the worst of the trilogy was far better than that hackfest.

[ Monday, January 21, 2008 15:37: Message edited by: Arancaytar ]

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Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00
Law Bringer
Member # 6785
Profile #14
Too bad Jeff doesn't want to do another game with plenty of non-linear exploring in addition to a linear quest. In trying to make his games more balanced to current party level he no longer wants to use party death as a limiting factor in exploration. Personally I always found that this was a good way to tell when you have exceeded your current level and need to turn back.

He could bring back puzzles and have a combat route through the same area for players that don't want to think.
Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00
Agent
Member # 8030
Profile Homepage #15
I'd feel disoriented on a game centered around exploring, as I'd feel uneasy with the lack of towns. However, I'm probably not considering Jeff's ability to create a whole new concept.

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set_name(1,"Excalibur");
Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00
Agent
Member # 4574
Profile #16
quote:
Originally written by Excalibur:

I'd feel disoriented on a game centered around exploring, as I'd feel uneasy with the lack of towns. However, I'm probably not considering Jeff's ability to create a whole new concept.
Yeah, that occured to me when I was replying to Alo. I guess there would have to be small settlements in the route, or atleast caches of supplies and the occasional wanderer, not necessarily sane mind you.

The aforementioned reasoning is why I suggested there simply be more Black Water and Za Khazi Run type places in the games. Much easier than making a game based off the concept.

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"I'm happy I'm the mentally disturbed person I am." -Nioca
"Yes, Iffy is a demon." -Iffy
"To fly, throw yourself at the ground and miss." -The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy
Posts: 1186 | Registered: Friday, June 18 2004 07:00
? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
Profile #17
There would likely be settlements of non-humans, or perhaps humans that are unlike the party in language or custom, and so they could easily be treated like non-humans. After all, there is precedent.

And hey, how about those sleeping pills?

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Synergy, et al - "I don't get it."

Argon - "I'm at a loss for words..."
Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00
Shaper
Member # 7420
Profile Homepage #18
quote:
Alorael:
I think the concept behind A2's Dark Waters and Za-Khazi could be expanded into a full game.
I thought that was what Jeff was going for with Avernum 5 but he sort of gave up shortly after the first chapter. I liked Avernum 5 better than Za-Khazi, but neither rank among my favorites as far as Jeff's works go. For me, the closer to Geneforge 2, the better. Science Fiction RPGs tend to have a lot of alien races fighting each other anyway, so the whole warring factions concept would be perfect.
quote:
Salmon:
And hey, how about those sleeping pills?
Oh, Salmon, you're such a joker.

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You lose.
Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00
Agent
Member # 8030
Profile Homepage #19
quote:
Oh, Salmon, you're such a joker.



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set_name(1,"Excalibur");
Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00
? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
Profile #20
quote:
Originally written by Excalibur:

quote:
Oh, Salmon, you're such a joker.


It really isn't fun to have to fill in the blanks.
ET was making a funny, and I was providing a non sequitur. See, it's all good. No real need to comment on things which you don't comprehend. :P

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Synergy, et al - "I don't get it."

Argon - "I'm at a loss for words..."
Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00
Infiltrator
Member # 65
Profile Homepage #21
Any chance of anything steampunk themed?

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Milla-Displacer Beastie

This is also a good site
Posts: 650 | Registered: Thursday, October 4 2001 07:00
Agent
Member # 8030
Profile Homepage #22
Well, I have yet to see a steampunk RPG, and Jeff is certainly one to surprise people.

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set_name(1,"Excalibur");
Posts: 1384 | Registered: Tuesday, February 6 2007 08:00
Shaper
Member # 7420
Profile Homepage #23
I doubt it. Avernum and Geneforge were both in totally unique worlds, so it would be very unlike Jeff to use an existing theme or whatever in one of his games.

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You lose.
Posts: 2156 | Registered: Thursday, August 24 2006 07:00
Law Bringer
Member # 2984
Profile Homepage #24
Excalibur: Google Arcanum. The demo is very short, but I kind of enjoyed it. Engine-wise, it's a Diablo clone really, but according to the one who recommended it to me (Alorael?) there's an option for turn-based combat.
Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00

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