I need to improve my plot...
| Author | Topic: I need to improve my plot... |
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Warrior
Member # 6846
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 00:42
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Ok, by now I have learned how to do most things with the BOA scenario editor. However, I lack possibly the most important thing: a good plot. I started a scenario with an idea about a demon controlling a village, but it seemed half-baked and I had no clear idea about how to finish it. Now I'm thinking of doing a book adaptation (one of course which would fit well into the world of avernum) but then there is the question of plagiarism. Thoughts on this or any ideas for plots of your own would be welcome. [ Saturday, May 13, 2006 00:44: Message edited by: Pyrulen ] -------------------- "Build a man a fire, and he´ll be warm for a day; set a man on fire, and he´ll be warm for the rest of his life." Posts: 65 | Registered: Thursday, March 2 2006 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 6652
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 01:08
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So, do you want help on the demon plot? Or ideas for other plots? Or some of both? I'm confused here, so I'll help with the demon one. "A demon controls a village" needs another twist, really, to make a plot. Perhaps the player doesn't know that the demon is controlling the village. Perhaps the demon is an ancient foe of that particular village that the PC's have a special reason to hate. Perhaps they're duped into helping the demon, then have to correct what they did unknowingly. I'm just brainstorming. Say more of what you want the scenario to be like and we can get more specific. As far as the book goes, I would go with making a scenario. Scenarios are considerably easier to make than novels, don't have to be accepted by publishing companies, and don't need to worry about copyright issues at all. Also, the world needs BOA scenarios more than it needs books. -------------------- But I don't want to ride the elevator. Posts: 420 | Registered: Sunday, January 8 2006 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 5459
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 01:32
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Ahem. I believe Pyrulen meant that he was going to adapt a book into a scenario. Personally I think a scenario like that could be a bit too ambitious for a first time designer, since it will most certainly become a largish scenario. As for the demon thing, I'll do some brainstroming m'self: Now this could easily be made into a short scenario. The party might just be passing through the village and notice how everyone is acting strangely or perhaps some of them will attack the party outright. Then the party will explore the mystery, maybe find someone who is resistant to the demon's mind control and this person will nudge the party in the right direction and boom! The party finds the huge fortress of the demon that no-one has noticed before despite it being in an obvious location and hackfest ensues. Of course some people will have a heart attack at the sight of the words "demon" and "scenario" being used in the same sentence. -------------------- These are my scenarios. I may have too much free time but I really don't care. Backwater Calls, Magus of Cattalon, Rats Aplenty Get them here Visit The Lyceum for all your rating needs. Posts: 211 | Registered: Sunday, January 30 2005 08:00 |
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...b10010b...
Member # 869
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 04:11
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I'd ask you one question: why do you want to make a scenario? The people who have the most success finishing scenarios are people who design to tell stories that are important to them. What stories are important to you? -------------------- The Empire Always Loses: This Time For Sure! Posts: 9973 | Registered: Saturday, March 30 2002 08:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 6846
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 05:05
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Here's how it stands: The reason I was a bit secretive with the current plot was that I wasn't sure if it would be worth scrapping the idea. Being someone who has lurked around for a while now, I know that most people on the boards can be critical of any plot involving the usual cliches (i.e. demons). For this reason I ask you, 'Would you want another demon hack/slash story, or do you want a plot with humour, twists, betrayals etc?'. Basically, I'm seeing if you'll confirm the latter (sorry if there was any confusion). PS: There WAS a twist in the original story, the benevolent mayor turns out to be the demon in disguise (not too dissimilar to Smoo's ideas). However, I thought this to be a bit obvious and the more experienced players might find the whole thing a bit dull. As far as a book adaptation might go, I was thinking along the lines of something by Terry Pratchett - what do you think? (too ambitious?) There are two ways in which an adaptation could happen: 1. Retain all settings and characters in their original fictional world 2. Transplant the main elements and characters of the plot to Ermarian EDIT: Then there's the question of what to do with free will. Should the plot be followed closely or should it have possible versions of events which deviate from the original narrative? To Thuryl: Are you not happy to design for the sheer sake of designing? Personally, I find it fun to sort out the details of the scenario, possibly at the expense of the bigger picture. For this reason I would be happy to work to pretty much any plot which is good and reasonably short. [ Saturday, May 13, 2006 05:18: Message edited by: Pyrulen ] -------------------- "Build a man a fire, and he´ll be warm for a day; set a man on fire, and he´ll be warm for the rest of his life." Posts: 65 | Registered: Thursday, March 2 2006 08:00 |
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Master
Member # 5977
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 05:43
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quote:Dull? I think this is absolutely brilliant! If its dull for the more experienced players, then let them play bahsikava (I'll really never know how to spell that, would I) or some other scenario. However, I don't see this as an excuse not to make a scenario. I'm sure that for any experienced player the level 1 scenarios may be dull too. Does it stop them from playing them? No. One more thing: Why should it be obvious that the mayor is the demon? This is entirely dependent on what you make of it. If you make it obvious, then it will be obvious. Place a pentagram in his quarters for example, and let the player think the mayor summoned the demon. Then send the party for some reason or an other to a cave, where the mayor sudenly appears and starts blaming you for all kinds of things, after which he turns into a demon. You can make dozens and a dozen more scenarios, all with their own little twist, from this one idea. I personally think its a good one. -------------------- Play and rate my scenarios: Where the rivers meet View my upcoming scenario: The Nephil Search: Escape. Give us your drek! Posts: 3029 | Registered: Saturday, June 18 2005 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 5459
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 05:54
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Pyrulen, what I want is a new scenario that's not made by me. It's been a while since one those showed up. On the Pratchett thing: I suppose one of the Vimes books would make a decent cityscape/crime mystery scenario. Some of the other books have too many different locations in them. Still: yes I think this would be too ambitious. On the demon thing: If you decide to make it anyway then please give thought on why the demon is controlling the village and not just doing the usual: "I evil! I kill!" - routine. -------------------- These are my scenarios. I may have too much free time but I really don't care. Backwater Calls, Magus of Cattalon, Rats Aplenty Get them here Visit The Lyceum for all your rating needs. Posts: 211 | Registered: Sunday, January 30 2005 08:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 6846
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 06:16
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That's an interesting thought, though not one that I hadn't considered, although as yet I haven't thought of a reason for this. The demon is hardly going to use some backwater village as a base to raise an army of conquering undead is it? Then there is the question of why the party is there in the first place; if there is seemingly no problem at the beginning, what are they there for? Is the 'just passing through' argument good enough? Without giving away the entire plot, one question remains: Where does the essential demonic boss lair fit in to all of this? -------------------- "Build a man a fire, and he´ll be warm for a day; set a man on fire, and he´ll be warm for the rest of his life." Posts: 65 | Registered: Thursday, March 2 2006 08:00 |
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Master
Member # 5977
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 08:39
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quote:The party could be there for several reasons: 1) passing through (probably most logical) 2) the mayor or some other high official raised alarm and asked for help => you were sent. These are the "official" reasons which have been used time on time again. I'm for being creative. This is what I got out of a short brainstorming session: 1) you have family up there who got sick, and you had to get them some herbs to heal them 2) Maybe you wanted a short vacation and came across this small, nice village? The the demonic boss question. You always get these sort of problems with mighty beings, alive or undead. It might be a better idea to consider a less powerful undead lord, like a spectre or a lich. -------------------- Play and rate my scenarios: Where the rivers meet View my upcoming scenario: The Nephil Search: Escape. Give us your drek! Posts: 3029 | Registered: Saturday, June 18 2005 07:00 |
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Lifecrafter
Member # 6193
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 09:25
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I don't see why the deamon/whatever it winds up being HAS to have a lair. Perhaps you could gather enough evidence to prove the mayor is the deamon, then drag him into town square and give him the whooping of a life time. All the while possessed townsmen run at you and attack. Perhaps a requirement will be you can't kill the townsfolk or something. This is just a brain storm but it seems interesting. -------------------- Guaranteed to blow your mind. Frostbite: Get It While It's...... Hot? Posts: 900 | Registered: Monday, August 8 2005 07:00 |
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Guardian
Member # 6670
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 12:30
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Crap. (Hides a half-finished scenario, which also features a demon, if only obliquely.) A few points I'd consider: Why this backwater village? Why masquerade as a mayor? Why just one demon without any support? One idea is that this demon fled the netherworld due to some demon versus demon conflict (I'm just spitballing here, the idea just came to me and stuck). Moral ambiguity is also a good thing; there's no reason why the demon shouldn't have a few redeeming qualities. Maybe it (as mayor) has done many good things for the village, but is leading the townspeople towards something that suits its own purposes. In this case, it's not even necessary to mind-control the citizens. As for why the party's there in the first place, maybe the demon is including them in one of its plans. Try find another reason, though; I'm doing this in my scenario. ;) Demonic lair... a toughie, especially in a backwater village. The only thing I can think off at the moment is a portal to a demiplane, which doesn't really fit with the rest of the scenario. EDIT: That's odd... I'm not usually in the habit of placing random punctuation... -------------------- IF I EVER BECOME AN EVIL OVERLORD: If I come into possession of an artifact which can only be used by the pure of heart, I will not attempt to use it regardless. [ Saturday, May 13, 2006 17:37: Message edited by: Dintiradan ] Posts: 1509 | Registered: Tuesday, January 10 2006 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Saturday, May 13 2006 19:44
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Pyrulen: Making a small, not-very-good scenario has its merits in itself. I wouldn't worry too much about the details the first time around; finish something, and for your second scenario make something you care about. Finish something. -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 5459
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written Sunday, May 14 2006 08:34
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quote:No. But maybe the demon is: a) Feeding on the minds of the townspeople, until they become drooling vegetables. b) Simply hiding from another demon or something. Maybe a power struggle in hell didn't go well for the demon. c) Using the humans as slave labor to uncover some kind of mystical artifact/build an evil machine. (These ideas suck if you don't refine them.) d) Maybe the demon got kicked out of hell and now he's lonely and tries to make friends with humans but doesn't understand how their minds work so he simply controls them and winds up being slain by bully adventurers. Sniff. That poor demon. quote:Well, gee. That's what I'm using in my new scenario. So, yes. quote:I like Lazarus' idea about killing the demon in the town square. Of course the demon could have also constructed some kind of cliched catacombs underneath the town. [ Sunday, May 14, 2006 08:35: Message edited by: Red 37 aka Smoo ] -------------------- These are my scenarios. I may have too much free time but I really don't care. Backwater Calls, Magus of Cattalon, Rats Aplenty Get them here Visit The Lyceum for all your rating needs. Posts: 211 | Registered: Sunday, January 30 2005 08:00 |
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Lifecrafter
Member # 6403
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written Sunday, May 14 2006 08:58
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Something I'd like to see is if this scenario can be pulled off in one town. It seems like it should, with a number of ending requirements. Some that spring to mind: kill the mayor in the basement of his manse and find a way to loose his hold on the townspeople there; give him the whooping of a lifetime in the village square while all the mutated citizens defend him; sneak into his lair and break whatever device that is controlling the villiagers and run your ass off with as many refugees as you can haul out of there. [ Sunday, May 14, 2006 08:59: Message edited by: radix malorum est cupiditas ] -------------------- ??? ?????? ???? ????? Posts: 883 | Registered: Wednesday, October 19 2005 07:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 6846
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written Sunday, May 14 2006 11:05
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Good ideas there, but now I've thought of something a little better... ;) I'll keep it a secret until the release. Then again, there is a good chance that some of them could be incorporated - I liked the town square idea for the climactic battle, although I prefer the villagers to be deceived rather than mind controlled, so that saving the villagers would be a goal. [ Sunday, May 14, 2006 11:06: Message edited by: Pyrulen ] -------------------- "Build a man a fire, and he´ll be warm for a day; set a man on fire, and he´ll be warm for the rest of his life." Posts: 65 | Registered: Thursday, March 2 2006 08:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 6111
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written Tuesday, May 16 2006 05:30
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well i hope you will use something else than undead as enemies,theyre boring,its not fun to hack poor innocent zombies to pieces just beacuse he wanted to eat your brains. Posts: 45 | Registered: Saturday, July 16 2005 07:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 7002
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written Wednesday, May 17 2006 09:01
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quote:Tidied up. Uhhh, he hasn't said he's going to use zombies. He said he was considering using crazed/mind-controlled villagers. And undead, in Avernum, can mean shades and ghosts, too, not just zombies. [ Wednesday, May 17, 2006 09:02: Message edited by: Mr.Bookworm ] -------------------- Polaris Posts: 193 | Registered: Thursday, April 6 2006 07:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 6111
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written Thursday, May 18 2006 10:40
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still undead are boring,or should i say,over used. Posts: 45 | Registered: Saturday, July 16 2005 07:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 6846
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written Thursday, May 18 2006 11:18
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All the more reason to let this topic Rest In Peace. -------------------- "Build a man a fire, and he´ll be warm for a day; set a man on fire, and he´ll be warm for the rest of his life." Posts: 65 | Registered: Thursday, March 2 2006 08:00 |