If You Were President...
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Shock Trooper
Member # 4445
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 16:23
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Well, to be fair, hiring someone at a small business is a big gamble. He/she'll be a large percentage of your workforce. So, taking risks isn't something small business owners want to do. A reasonable person wouldn't see a black person as a risk, but, let's face it - cornrows, tattoos, pants around the crotch, big jewelry, and a certain manner of speaking correlate with a lot of behaviors people don't want in an employee (whatever the person's race - it just so happens that a lot of black people around where I live fit that description). When all you get is a first impression, you just aren't going to hire someone meeting that description (well, I'm not). Hence, affirmative action. You can't expect small business owners to give chances to the urban poor on their own. Posts: 293 | Registered: Saturday, May 29 2004 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 16:55
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An interesting point to note is the assumption, which is generally borne out, that blacks need black role models. —Alorael, who has seen very interesting statistics (in hard copy, so he can't post a link). If wealth is broken down by more specific ethnic background than race, the story is different. Certain Asians (but not all) are far more likely to move up in class than whites, and whites aren't homogenous either. Most interesting is the fact that most immigrant groups tend to increase in class generationally at an encouraging rate. African Americans (Africans who immigrated within the past generation or two) are included among these groups. Blacks (non-recent immigrant) trail behind. Appearance and race aren't the whole story. Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 7002
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 17:38
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quote:Banning abortion doesn't and never will, work. Say you banned abortion. Within days, a blackmarket would spring up. For the numerous pregnant teenage girls who can't afford it, they would just go back to coathangers. -------------------- Polaris Posts: 193 | Registered: Thursday, April 6 2006 07:00 |
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E Equals MC What!!!!
Member # 5491
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 19:05
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quote:As I said, I'm not really interested in getting into an argument on this issue right now. Suffice it to say I don't entirely agree. -------------------- SupaNik: Aran, you're not big enough to threaten Ash. Dammit, even JV had to think twice. Posts: 1861 | Registered: Friday, February 11 2005 08:00 |
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BANNED
Member # 4
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 19:32
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How the hell can you ban coathangers? Will you actually waste taxpayer time and money to moniter mifepristone black markets? Hell, even OD'ing on birth control pills can be used for abortions within the first three weeks of the pregnancy. And okay, I'm no herbalist, but there are also herbs that can be used for abortions at any phase of the pregnancy. So let's get beyond the notion that you can actually keep the MEANS out of peoples' hands. The only solution left is to discover whether or not people are pregnant at any one time, and how the hell do you plan on that, Mr. Big Brother? Are you going to give pregnancy tests EVERY DAY? Preventing abortions is flat-out impossible. You can make it more DIFFICULT, but by no means imposible. I am not arguing in favor or against abortion (although let it be known that banning abortion is a universally wrong thing under any and all circumstances simply because of the misogyny), but your proposition of banning it would be a waste of time. You COULD prevent abortions, however, by teaching safe sex in schools. Because as much as I'm sure you hate sex, I will say this much: In the heirarchy of sins, sticking latex on your dick is inarguably worse than "booger murder." (Plus, safe sex has the added benefit of keeping STDs on the down-low. Condoms do not prevent STDs from spreadin 100% of the time, but their percentage rating is MUCH higher than you would be led to believe.) EDIT: And I will get to the rest of the thread whenever I can figure out which points have already been refuted and which remaining ones actually merit my time. [ Thursday, May 04, 2006 19:33: Message edited by: Keto-san ] -------------------- * Posts: 6936 | Registered: Tuesday, September 18 2001 07:00 |
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Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 19:34
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Down, boy! -------------------- Slarty vs. Desk • Desk vs. Slarty • Timeline of Ermarian • G4 Strategy Central Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00 |
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? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 20:20
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While it is convenient to say "white" and "black", it would be nice if we opted to identify races by cultural heritage rather than skin color. It is easy to do and helps to move us further away from the time honored tradition of equating skin color with worth. Thank you. -------------------- quote: Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |
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BANNED
Member # 4
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 20:23
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quote:If we gloss over racial terms, then we pretend the problem doesn't exist. It's the rhetorical equivalent of colorblindness, and it convinces us that we've actually done something to combat racism. It's a placebo. (A white placebo.) -------------------- * Posts: 6936 | Registered: Tuesday, September 18 2001 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 4445
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 20:41
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If and when the majority of black people I know refer to themselves as African-Americans and to whites as Caucasians (I'd say vice versa, but the terms would then obviously be themselves offensive), then I will comply with that request. As it is, the standard monosyllables are preferable for both the keyboad and the tongue. (Besides, political correctness is the biggest "what's that, we're racist? HEY LOOK OVER THERE!" pulled by whites in the 21st century) [ Thursday, May 04, 2006 20:47: Message edited by: PoD person ] Posts: 293 | Registered: Saturday, May 29 2004 07:00 |
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? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 21:11
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quote:Trying to change what isn't working is not the same as pretending the problem doesn't exist. It may actually help change racism. Placebos can cure disease. Maybe I'm missing something. quote:Most people refer to themselves as "me" or "I", or in extreme cases "Dikiyoba." Most people also refer to their communities by stating the geographical place-name, or another commonly used variant (eg. Savin Hill, Piedmont, or Raleigh Hills). I'm not sure I've ever heard anyone respond to any sort of interrogative with the statement "Well, I'm white you know." Maybe I just haven't been around as much as you. Maybe. -------------------- quote: Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 21:26
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quote:Um, no. That's ethnicity. There's a difference. Speaking of which, I'm not sure that there really are politically correct and accurate equivalents for the old "Caucasoid," "Negroid," and "Mongoloid" terms. There's "white" and "black," but "yellow" has kind of fallen out of fashion, and "Asian-American" is far too vague, since people from India and the Middle East are by most standards "Caucasoid." I'm not aware of a solution to this linguistic problem. -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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? Man, ? Amazing
Member # 5755
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 21:38
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So, what you are saying is that Racism is based not on race (we are all one race) but on skin color alone? So why again would it be wrong to stop identifying folks by the color of their skin. I chose ethnicity out of the apparently misplaced faith in humanity that somehow racism was tied into something other than blatant prejudice. Apologies to all those who were slighted by this misplaced faith. Edit - Spellchecking cant correct everything. [ Thursday, May 04, 2006 21:39: Message edited by: Jumpin' Salmon ] -------------------- quote: Posts: 4114 | Registered: Monday, April 25 2005 07:00 |
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E Equals MC What!!!!
Member # 5491
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written Thursday, May 4 2006 21:42
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quote:Sorry, didn't mean to go clip-clopping over your bridge. -------------------- SupaNik: Aran, you're not big enough to threaten Ash. Dammit, even JV had to think twice. Posts: 1861 | Registered: Friday, February 11 2005 08:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 6652
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written Friday, May 5 2006 01:07
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quote:Saying Indian and Middle Eastern works pretty well. But anyway. Politicians say "black" and "white". Teachers say "black" and "white". Blacks say "black" and "white". Whites say "black" and "white". Saying anything else gives the person on the street an impression that we're distant and naive and don't actually know anything about them. -------------------- But I don't want to ride the elevator. Posts: 420 | Registered: Sunday, January 8 2006 08:00 |
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Triad Mage
Member # 7
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written Friday, May 5 2006 01:19
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You want black role models? Damon Dash, Russell Simmons, Booker T. Washington, George Washington Carver, WEB DuBois, Thurgood Marshall, Martin Luther King, Jackie Robinson, etc. There aren't many spectacular white role models either - professional athletes, actors, and singers are equal no matter what race they are. -------------------- "At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander ==== Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet ==== You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse! Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 4445
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written Friday, May 5 2006 02:08
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quote:Not an interrogative, but people I know of all races venture a lot of opinions about both Caucasians and African descendendants, using the terminology "black" and "white." (Actually, the African-Americans I know from harsher circumstances primarily use a term you'd find far more offensive in self-reference and in the third person.) Posts: 293 | Registered: Saturday, May 29 2004 07:00 |
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Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
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written Friday, May 5 2006 03:25
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quote:Quoted for emphasis. -------------------- Slarty vs. Desk • Desk vs. Slarty • Timeline of Ermarian • G4 Strategy Central Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 3980
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written Friday, May 5 2006 03:39
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quote:This goes beyond upwards mobility. Immigrants self select and doe experience something like a crisis which is likely to result in some catharsis. I believe that self selection results in immigrants with strong initiative and, in addition, the experience make nicer more hardworking people. Emigrating to another country is not the only way. -------------------- The opposite of love is not hate, it's indifference. The opposite of art is not ugliness, it's indifference. The opposite of faith is not heresy, it's indifference. And the opposite of life is not death, it's indifference. Because of indifference, one dies before one actually dies. (not mine) Posts: 311 | Registered: Friday, February 13 2004 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Friday, May 5 2006 06:55
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quote:But that fails to capture the fact that racially (but not ethnically!) they're the same as Europeans. For those who don't know, I'm talking about the difference between race and ethnicity. In ethnic studies, one talks about the two things separately: there are essentially three races (white, black, and East Asian), and there are dozens of ethnicities (Hispanic, Middle Eastern, Indian, etc.). Anyone from any race can be a member of any of the ethnicities: most obviously, Hispanics are often white, but many are black. What I was saying in my post above is that one of the problems in talking about race is that there isn't a set of terms that is both logically consistent and politically correct. quote:I said there aren't many famous black scientists and businessmen (outside the context of the entertainment industry). I still can't think of "the black Bill Gates" or "the black Albert Einstein." -------------------- Arancaytar: Every time you ask people to compare TM and Kel, you endanger the poor, fluffy kittens. Smoo: Get ready to face the walls! Ephesos: In conclusion, yarr. Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!!: the authorized location for all things by me The Archive of all released BoE scenarios ever Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Nuke and Pave
Member # 24
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written Friday, May 5 2006 08:18
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quote:FYI, in Europe ethnicity plays the same role as race does in America. People always have their prejudices and if everybody around has same skin color, they focus on ethnicity (combination of language, religion, etc.) instead. -------------------- Be careful with a word, as you would with a sword, For it too has the power to kill. However well placed word, unlike a well placed sword, Can also have the power to heal. Posts: 2649 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00 |