Books Being Made Into Movies
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Shock Trooper
Member # 3898
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 00:27
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My opinion on that insult to Tolkien's memory that they called the LoTR movies are similar to those that the average oldbie had for Avernum 1 when it was first released, except magnified about fifteen times stronger and without the saving graces that Avernum might have had. Other than that, I think that books made into movies tend to survive the transition better than movies do when made into books, but despite this, of all the movies based on books I've seen, almost all of them were better as a book. Although I did quite like One Flew Over The Cuckoo's Nest in both forms. -------------------- ~Note : The professional newbie's advice should not be taken seriously, or at all.~ LINKAGE Posts: 364 | Registered: Saturday, January 17 2004 08:00 |
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This Side Towards Enemy
Member # 3098
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 01:11
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I actually think that the LOTR films were an improvement on the books. Obviously I think some things worked better in the book, because I'll always have a gripe, but I would rate the film higher. Troy, on the other hand, was a disaster. Not just because it had almost nothing to do with the epic cycle (the Iliad only covers a very short part of the siege of Troy, after all,) but because it was terrible. As to how we know Homer was blind - we don't, and given that Iliad, Odyssey and the other lost epics were developed over centuries and only codified about 700 years after Troy might have been besieged by a Mycenean king exercising a osrt of overlordship over Greece, it's unlikely that everybody who played a role in making the Iliad and Odyssey lacked sight. It's mostly due to long tradition (although if you asked any classical author who Homer was, they'd tell you a different shaggy-dog story they heard off a man in a pub) and the Phaecian poet in the Odyssey, who's blind. I've never seen a Harry Potter film. However I can agree that Order of the Phoenix was pretty irritating. My major problem was with Harry's characterisation, which basically stretched to "Harry was very angry. He didn't know why." -------------------- Voice of Reasonable Morality Posts: 961 | Registered: Thursday, June 12 2003 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 1558
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 03:44
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Yeah, it was a time waster. I'm with Ash, I have a lot of expectation for the last two. And the next movie, I love Emma :D . LoTR movies better than the books? You crazy man? The books have two minor problems that I can think of, I won't list them here. The movies are not very faithful to the books in the first place - that would be a problem except I think that a lot of the changes they made were unnecessary, not done properly, or just bad in the first place. About A Boy is better than the book, that's the only occurance I can think of right now. -------------------- I'm tired of the strain and the pain ___ ___ ___ I feel the same, I feel nothing Nothing is important to me ___ ___ ___ ___ __ And nobody nowhere understands anything About me and all my dreams lost at sea ___ __ But we’re not the same, we’re different tonight We’ll make things right, we’ll feel it all tonight _ The indescribable moments of your life tonight The impossible is possible tonight ___ ____ ___ Believe in me as I believe in you, tonight Go All Blacks xtraMSN Rugby _ MuggleNet Posts: 1112 | Registered: Friday, July 19 2002 07:00 |
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Infiltrator
Member # 5806
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 04:16
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quote:Russian names are horribly difficult to remember for some reason. And the name is Vassily Zajtsev. The battle of Stalinggrad was between August 1942-February 1943. I have nothing more to add to this matter. -------------------- So, as the great Groxy, I have come back to be served by goblins. In the "main hall" of the goblin cave was a large totem which resembled very much of... me. Posts: 437 | Registered: Friday, May 13 2005 07:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 04:25
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Funny, I could argue either way about LOTR and its films. What I think I'd try to insist on was that the films were pretty darn good efforts at translating the story into a very different medium, one in which many of the strengths of the books couldn't possible appear, and in which many other strengths would have to be invented independently. -------------------- It is not enough to discover how things seem to seem. We must discover how things really seem. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 1546
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 04:32
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LoTR Books Long, interesting, and filled with stuff. LoTR Movies Long. Being general is good when a) details arent necessary and b) you're lazy. There's no way in hell the movies were better than the books, unless you have a completely inept imagination. -------------------- A Sucaran Child is standing here. You say, "hello" The small child looks at Preserver Aldous wide-eyed and awed. Posts: 269 | Registered: Friday, July 19 2002 07:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 3898
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 04:47
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An explanation of exactly why I despise the movies boils down to two points. One is that while the main selling point of the book was the story and the sense of wonder that it creates by giving the reader the idea that the world of Middle-Earth is as realistic and deep and alive as ours, while the main selling point of the movies were the UB3R L33T KEWL BATLTES!!!111 and the poorly done romantic subplot (why must almost every goddamn movie, even ones where all the main characters are children under the age of eight, have a romantic subplot?) The second is that the movies relegated Faramir to the role of an ambitious idiot who is overcome by his conscience, Sam to an immature, prepubescent sidekick, and Gimli to a bumbling, intentionally stupid character designed only for comic relief (and as a foil to the stupidly magnified Legolas). Plus, they got rid of the Scouring of the Shire. And I find that screenplays adapted into movies tend to work out very well actually. Depends upon the screenplay, of course. -------------------- ~Note : The professional newbie's advice should not be taken seriously, or at all.~ LINKAGE Posts: 364 | Registered: Saturday, January 17 2004 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 2984
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 05:25
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quote:Isn't that interesting? The main point I got from the LotR movie were the fantastic landscape shots and settings, which managed to convey to me a feeling similar to what the book had done with its verbose descriptions - ie. a deep, realistic and alive world. Who cares about the battles? Oh, and make no mistake; I was pissed when they made Saruman do that tumble off the tower on top of the spike wheel, and did not even deign to include that in the theatre edition. But I also realize that there was no way in hell Bombadil could have been included without absolutely ruining the movie from the start. Bombadil is "Hobbit"-stuff, as are names like "Ori, Dori, Oin and Gloin". And after what happened earlier, the Scouring would have been anticlimactic in the extreme - like a sequel before the movie has even ended. Also, no movie is better than its book. Of course it isn't as good. But when considering a work like Tolkien's, how much does that really say? Edit: Congrats? What for? Hey! :eek: YAY! Edit: Celebratory images moved to other thread that already is about postwhoring. [ Wednesday, June 15, 2005 05:39: Message edited by: 2984 ] -------------------- The Encyclopaedia Ermariana <-- Now a Wiki! "Polaris leers down from the black vault, winking hideously like an insane watching eye which strives to convey some strange message, yet recalls nothing save that it once had a message to convey." --- HP Lovecraft. "I single Aran out due to his nasty temperament, and his superior intellect." --- SupaNik Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 1558
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 05:28
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Congrats Aran! ^__^ Happy Da! I agree that the Scouring would have been too hard to add and keep it effective. One of my biggest peeves is the down-grading of Sam. I mean, he doesn't even use the Ring! EDIT: I disagree, I'm gonna mention that About A Boy is better than it's book. But, how many of you have even heard of this movie or read the book? [ Wednesday, June 15, 2005 05:37: Message edited by: An Upright stranger ] -------------------- I'm tired of the strain and the pain ___ ___ ___ I feel the same, I feel nothing Nothing is important to me ___ ___ ___ ___ __ And nobody nowhere understands anything About me and all my dreams lost at sea ___ __ But we’re not the same, we’re different tonight We’ll make things right, we’ll feel it all tonight _ The indescribable moments of your life tonight The impossible is possible tonight ___ ____ ___ Believe in me as I believe in you, tonight Go All Blacks xtraMSN Rugby _ MuggleNet Posts: 1112 | Registered: Friday, July 19 2002 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 2984
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 05:36
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I have heard of, but thankfully not seen/read either of that. My sister told me about it; she was fascinated by the movie. When my sister used to tell me about a movie she'd seen, and it sounded awfully dumb, I usually attributed that to a poor retelling. Gosh was I wrong. Once, I saw a movie she recommended. Never again. [ Wednesday, June 15, 2005 05:36: Message edited by: 2984 ] -------------------- The Encyclopaedia Ermariana <-- Now a Wiki! "Polaris leers down from the black vault, winking hideously like an insane watching eye which strives to convey some strange message, yet recalls nothing save that it once had a message to convey." --- HP Lovecraft. "I single Aran out due to his nasty temperament, and his superior intellect." --- SupaNik Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 1558
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 05:41
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:D Maybe it was just bad luck. And hey, don't slam that movie. I wish I could think of another example of a good movie upgrade. -------------------- I'm tired of the strain and the pain ___ ___ ___ I feel the same, I feel nothing Nothing is important to me ___ ___ ___ ___ __ And nobody nowhere understands anything About me and all my dreams lost at sea ___ __ But we’re not the same, we’re different tonight We’ll make things right, we’ll feel it all tonight _ The indescribable moments of your life tonight The impossible is possible tonight ___ ____ ___ Believe in me as I believe in you, tonight Go All Blacks xtraMSN Rugby _ MuggleNet Posts: 1112 | Registered: Friday, July 19 2002 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 2984
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 05:43
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While we're at it, what do you think about movies being made into books? I can think of several examples, but I'm not sure if I got any of them correct. Wasn't Men in Black a movie before it was a book? -------------------- The Encyclopaedia Ermariana <-- Now a Wiki! "Polaris leers down from the black vault, winking hideously like an insane watching eye which strives to convey some strange message, yet recalls nothing save that it once had a message to convey." --- HP Lovecraft. "I single Aran out due to his nasty temperament, and his superior intellect." --- SupaNik Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 1558
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 05:52
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Hmm, I can't think of a MiB book. And there's still a bad smell lingering from the second movie. But that doesn't detract from the first. It's awesome, and I don't believe a book could be made from it which is better. Ok, in general, I don't think that many movies would be able to be transcribed into book form because watching a movie takes one and a half to three hours, and reading a novel takes (let's say) closer to three or four times that. The problem is: at the end of that two hour movie, it's all done and dusted right there. If you decide to write a book from it, you're gonna have to find a lot more to write than what is in the movie alone. This is my same view on why books aren't usually transormed into good movies, except in reverse. [ Wednesday, June 15, 2005 05:53: Message edited by: An Upright stranger ] -------------------- I'm tired of the strain and the pain ___ ___ ___ I feel the same, I feel nothing Nothing is important to me ___ ___ ___ ___ __ And nobody nowhere understands anything About me and all my dreams lost at sea ___ __ But we’re not the same, we’re different tonight We’ll make things right, we’ll feel it all tonight _ The indescribable moments of your life tonight The impossible is possible tonight ___ ____ ___ Believe in me as I believe in you, tonight Go All Blacks xtraMSN Rugby _ MuggleNet Posts: 1112 | Registered: Friday, July 19 2002 07:00 |
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Apprentice
Member # 5959
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 07:01
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quote:I saw the movie recently and liked it, but I only found out after I saw it that it was a book. Now I have to get a copy out of the library... Posts: 2 | Registered: Tuesday, June 14 2005 07:00 |
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Nuke and Pave
Member # 24
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 08:11
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quote:Romantic subplots are part of standart Hollywood template. Just like having exessively good looking actors in leading roles, even for the characters whose main attribute is supposed to be their ugliness. Other than that, it's impossible to turn a book that takes 40 hours to read into a movie that takes 9 hours to watch without dropping a lot of details or subplots. Russian War and Peace movie, which I was one of the best movies I ever saw, did a good job of picking some plotlines and staying true to them. PS Somebody mentioned movie versions of "A Song of Ice and Fire" series. The author himself said that the series is so long that movie adaptation would have to be in the form of a TV series and he isn't too hopeful for it. It might be a good series if they ever make it. But knowing Hollywood, Tyrion (an ugly dwarf) will probably be played by a tall and beautiful actor. :) -------------------- Be careful with a word, as you would with a sword, For it too has the power to kill. However well placed word, unlike a well placed sword, Can also have the power to heal. Posts: 2649 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 08:15
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Men in Black was originally a comic book series. Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 335
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 10:04
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As others have already pointed out, different media work very differently. I don't think there's anything inherently wrong with turning a book into a movie or vice versa, but it's very rare for any work to be great on one medium and still great when transferred to another without heavy revision. LotR is actually a fair success story: the movie isn't exactly the same as the book, and it's enjoyable for different reasons, but it also maintains a good deal of original Middle Earth, Lord of the Rings feel and, aside from some necessary cutting for time, sticks to the original plot. I'll just say that most of the books I like the most have a great deal of writing that isn't action or dialogue, and those are really the only things that a movie can show well. The movie to book treatment is in many ways easier to pull off because a book can show anything that the author can write, but action and dialogue alone make for a poor book unless they're augmented with the author's own additions. I don't think I can think of any successful movie to book examples. —Alorael, who would like to see Beowulf turned into a movie. Not because it's an especially movie-worthy story or anything, but because epics really do tend to lend themselves to movie treatment much more easily than novels. Anonymous poets (and Homer) seem much less concerned with deep introspection and angst than with glorious battle, mountains of gore, and men who are actually strong and handsome enough for Hollywood to portray as it likes. Posts: 14579 | Registered: Saturday, December 1 2001 08:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 10:48
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Jane Fonda could play Grendel's mom. -------------------- It is not enough to discover how things seem to seem. We must discover how things really seem. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 32
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 11:30
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If you are going to do Beowulf, you might as well do Grendel along side of it. Not only will you make more money, but you'll see both sides of the story. -------------------- Lt. Sullust Cogito Ergo Sum Polaris Posts: 2462 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 11:51
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Well, leaving out Grendel entirely would certainly lose you that vital 13-20 year-old male demographic: Beowulf: Whassup? Hrothgar: Nothin'. *roll credits* But a little Google tells me you must have meant Grendel by John Gardner, which retells Beowulf from the monster's perspective. Is it any good? -------------------- It is not enough to discover how things seem to seem. We must discover how things really seem. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 32
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 12:10
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It made me think that the people kinda deserved what Grendel did to them. So there went Beowulf's good reputation... -------------------- Lt. Sullust Cogito Ergo Sum Polaris Posts: 2462 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00 |
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La Canaliste
Member # 5563
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written Wednesday, June 15 2005 12:29
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The Third Man was written as a screenplay before it was a book... that's all I can think of right now. -------------------- I am a pale shadow of the previous self. quote: Deep down, you know you should have voted for Alcritas! Posts: 387 | Registered: Tuesday, March 1 2005 08:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 5450
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written Thursday, June 16 2005 03:07
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quote:Plan: Get back into human form, and if there is time, kill Harry. Doesn't really seem stupid to me. -------------------- I'll put a Spring in your step. Polaris Posts: 2396 | Registered: Saturday, January 29 2005 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 2984
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written Thursday, June 16 2005 04:03
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quote:Read "101 Rules for Villains". Luring the protagonist into an ingenuously designed death-trap and then try to kill him in a mock-duel is about as dumb as it gets. If he wants the blood, he could get it in a more subtle way, possibly without having to abduct him. For one thing, he'd have a chance at resurrecting himself without anybody noticing. By abducting Harry, he is taking a big risk: Should Harry get away - as he does - Dumbledore will be alerted immediately. So he spends an entire year setting up an imposter, designing a clever abduction trap, and basically counting on being able to kill the same person who nearly destroyed him as a baby. No less, he is so sure of himself that he baits his enemy and allows him the chance of winning a duel. A waste of evil. :P [ Thursday, June 16, 2005 04:05: Message edited by: 2984 ] -------------------- The Encyclopaedia Ermariana <-- Now a Wiki! "Polaris leers down from the black vault, winking hideously like an insane watching eye which strives to convey some strange message, yet recalls nothing save that it once had a message to convey." --- HP Lovecraft. "I single Aran out due to his nasty temperament, and his superior intellect." --- SupaNik Posts: 8752 | Registered: Wednesday, May 14 2003 07:00 |
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Guardian
Member # 3521
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written Thursday, June 16 2005 12:05
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quote:I'd dismiss it as a chick flick, but that would be a grievous insult to women. -------------------- Stughalf "Delusion arises from anger. The mind is bewildered by delusion. Reasoning is destroyed when the mind is bewildered. One falls down when reasoning is destroyed."- The Bhagavad Gita. Posts: 1798 | Registered: Sunday, October 5 2003 07:00 |