Over my rather deceased cadaver. Rrrrrrr.
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| Author | Topic: Over my rather deceased cadaver. Rrrrrrr. |
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Agent
Member # 618
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written Tuesday, May 4 2004 12:28
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Cannot. Be. Smothered. This bores me. I lay down the tenets and look... damn semantics frags it. Forget about picking holes in it for one second and look at what you have said. Mind may be over matter, but this is hypocrisy. With sticks. -------------------- I like to say quack because I can, I like to say moooo because I can, but I don't like saying ergle flmp because I can never pronounce phenomenon first try. In conclusion, quack, moooo and phenonemenonmenonnon... Oh Poo. http://s4.invisionfree.com/Ultimate_RP/index.php Try it! Posts: 1487 | Registered: Sunday, February 10 2002 08:00 |
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By Committee
Member # 4233
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written Tuesday, May 4 2004 12:31
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Maybe if you say something substantive instead of flaming everyone, you'll get something out of it.  Posts: 2242 | Registered: Saturday, April 10 2004 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 618
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written Tuesday, May 4 2004 12:50
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Actually, with the exception of your fine self (which I still dispute), I have not flambed anyone recently. Saying something that actually means something? Whoah! I mean slow down! There's no need to rush things!In conclusion: Pointy Sticks?, Who Will Buy My -------------------- I like to say quack because I can, I like to say moooo because I can, but I don't like saying ergle flmp because I can never pronounce phenomenon first try. In conclusion, quack, moooo and phenonemenonmenonnon... Oh Poo. http://s4.invisionfree.com/Ultimate_RP/index.php Try it! Posts: 1487 | Registered: Sunday, February 10 2002 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Tuesday, May 4 2004 19:53
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My apologies to anyone who is still bothering to read these posts, but I just can't do it. I can't let this slide. I should speak to a psychotherapist about OCD. quote:WTF are you talking about? What is hypocrisy? To whom are you speaking, and about what? Semantics isn't what's pulling down your arguments (which is not spelled arguements, but arguments). Their inherent flaws are bringing down your arguments. Your incorrect usage of words just isn't helping, that's all. (Remember that I said that I'd let the "elegant" thing slide to begin with. You just told me that I was wrong, which caused it to be an issue.) -------------------- Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!! (The home of BoA's HLPM v1.1!) Rate my scenarios! Northern Kingdom 0: Prologue High Level Party Maker Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 618
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written Wednesday, May 5 2004 10:20
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(I will be calm. I will not start a flame war) *deep breath* I cannot think of the correct words. This causes the mis-understanding. This is hypocrisy. We are discussing something which is not complete yet. To offer the entire plan yet would be stupid as it is not yet complete. And even then I need to iron out the feasabilities. I claimed fault on "elegant" simply because, as all language is "made-up", it is open to interpretation. Similar to certain other words like "generation" (as in the passage of years). I too apologise to anyone who is bored out of their skull by now (ie. everyone). This is a matter of principles now. And thus, bores. -------------------- I like to say quack because I can, I like to say moooo because I can, but I don't like saying ergle flmp because I can never pronounce phenomenon first try. In conclusion, quack, moooo and phenonemenonmenonnon... Oh Poo. http://s4.invisionfree.com/Ultimate_RP/index.php Try it! Posts: 1487 | Registered: Sunday, February 10 2002 08:00 |
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This Side Towards Enemy
Member # 3098
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written Wednesday, May 5 2004 12:33
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Language is open to interpretation? So if I say never means always I have a valid case? I someone don't think so. Indeed, if we're to accept Occam's Razor, then the simplest answer is the most elegant. -------------------- "I particularly like the part where he claims not to know what self-aggrandisement means, then demands more wing-wongs up his virgin ass" Posts: 961 | Registered: Thursday, June 12 2003 07:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Wednesday, May 5 2004 12:38
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quote: quote:So then clearly it is not so easy to devise a system that is more functional than the ones that we have, which was my point at the beginning of this discussion. But the problem runs deeper than this. I have outlined a few problems that are fundamental to your system and your method of thinking, and I have raised important questions that you still have not answered, and anything that develops from your statements above will have to jump over some serious hurdles to deal with these issues. (In what way will your government function better than the ones in existence now? How will you make your government genuinely able to resist corruption other than just through complexity, since you have thrown away the informed consent of the governed? And so on.) And finally: Hypocrisy, n. : 1. The practice of professing beliefs, feelings, or virtues that one does not hold or possess; falseness. 2. An act or instance of such falseness. When has such an act been committed anywhere in here? I can't recall ever having professed beliefs, feelings, or virtues that I do not possess, and I have not observed others doing so. -------------------- Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!! (The home of BoA's HLPM v1.1!) Rate my scenarios! Northern Kingdom 0: Prologue High Level Party Maker Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 618
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written Thursday, May 6 2004 11:31
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Kel, the whole point was that you were bringing up "bugs" that would have been fixed long before roll-out. It is only early in design and it would be damn stupid for me to go fixing every single problem now. The only reason any of this ever happened, was because YOU asked if I had anything better than the present government. When I have finished it and sovled all the faults in the design, THEN, maybe is it something to discuss potential problems. In that I was stupid enough to practice hypocrisy against my own principle. Devising a new system is not easy. I never said it was, but dammit I'm trying, which is a dang sight more than I could say for you. I have answered every query to the best of my abilities and yet you still can't figure out that it is still going around in my head and on paper. My way of thinking is certainly not something easily judged. ESPECIALLY not in such a crude form of communication. Unless you have something of GENUINE USE to offer and not just pointless criticism, I suggest the matter is left alone for now. Good day. Bleh, feh, meh. -------------------- I like to say quack because I can, I like to say moooo because I can, but I don't like saying ergle flmp because I can never pronounce phenomenon first try. In conclusion, quack, moooo and phenonemenonmenonnon... Oh Poo. http://s4.invisionfree.com/Ultimate_RP/index.php Try it! Posts: 1487 | Registered: Sunday, February 10 2002 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Thursday, May 6 2004 11:53
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quote:Yes, you did. See the above quote. quote:You don't know that. I recognize flaws in the current governing systems. I just recognize flaws in what you've brought up, too. quote:Again, not true. I know that it is an idea in your head. I also know that the direction of your thinking needs revision, which you have stated that you recognize, so we're in some kind of agreement. quote:Pointless? These are serious issues that you must consider. Even semantics are important. The Constitution (and I suppose the British equivalent would be something like the Magna Carta) wouldn't have survived this long if it were sloppily worded. I'm not saying that you have to have all the answers now. I'm just saying that you haven't yet come up with a better system than the ones we have now, so the fact that you're working on one doesn't lend credence to the statement that I originally objected to, namely that anyone ("even Alec") could come up with something better than what we have now. It seems that we're at some level of agreement that your system has some issues that need to be resolved (and will be resolved, you say), so I am fine with ending this discussion, too. -------------------- Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!! (The home of BoA's HLPM v1.1!) Rate my scenarios! Northern Kingdom 0: Prologue High Level Party Maker Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 517
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written Friday, May 7 2004 06:39
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quote:Actually, the Magna Carta was withdrawn only a few years after it was first written. It set the pattern for the later Parliment, but didn't create it. -E- -------------------- Let them eat cake! Polaris Boards: The System is Up. Perennially. Posts: 2314 | Registered: Tuesday, January 15 2002 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Friday, May 7 2004 08:28
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Well, yeah, but there is no British equivalent to the US Constitution. I was just grabbing for a major document in the history of the British government. It doesn't matter. The point is still the same. [ Friday, May 07, 2004 08:35: Message edited by: Kelandon ] -------------------- Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!! (The home of BoA's HLPM v1.1!) Rate my scenarios! Northern Kingdom 0: Prologue High Level Party Maker Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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This Side Towards Enemy
Member # 3098
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written Friday, May 7 2004 12:33
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Indeed, why is it better to create a new system than to try to make the present system. Offhand I can recall only two fleshed-out coherent ideas for new systems of governance, devised respectively by Marx and Plato, and both of those are fatally flawed (Marx in his assumption that scarcity would disappear as a consequence of industrialisation and Plato in his trying to make subjectives absolute leading to the ridiculous theory of forms.) -------------------- "I particularly like the part where he claims not to know what self-aggrandisement means, then demands more wing-wongs up his virgin ass" Posts: 961 | Registered: Thursday, June 12 2003 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 3349
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written Friday, May 7 2004 12:49
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somehow when I tried posting a reply to the one about me emailing people my story it came to this. Oh well. I'll do THIS then.   -------------------- Espresso hasn't been invented yet. That stinks. Xian Skull- Avernum 3 Posts: 1287 | Registered: Thursday, August 14 2003 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 618
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written Friday, May 7 2004 13:18
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Mmmm... how fun. Kel, all I said about the ease of designing a new system, was that Alec could probably think of something. I never said it would be a better or worse one. In fact, despite Alec's downright arrogance, he could probably come up with a very good model. You keep on harping about solving the problems. The dang thing isn't even half-finished yet! Is a programmer able to fix the bugs in a line of code BEFORE it is written  ? Well?No. My line of thought is not even perpendicular to what we are discussing. I merely stated that what you bring up is not a concern at the moment. So I am afraid to inform you that you are in mistake in believing agreement. Constitutions are just stupid, they complicate things no end. There are very few countries that use one or an equivilent and those that do, generally speaking, are lame. In fact, so lame that they could be called lem. In fact so lem that they are lemmer than LemSip .And quite frankly, your apparent requirement to have documents ruling the government, rather than actual plain ole common sense, is, shall we say, disappointing :confused: . There are, and will, be issues that will be solved. There are no two ways about it. TARD, it has gotten to a point where the present government in this country cannot be improved. Not because it has reached the best state, but instead because of widespread resistance to change within it. Also, the fundamental cores of this government is very difficult to change, through the way that the law is. As for the discussion, yes, at this point I am quite happy to end it before some more redundant and idiotic comments are made. But knowing these boards, someone will want the last word. :rolleyes: -------------------- I like to say quack because I can, I like to say moooo because I can, but I don't like saying ergle flmp because I can never pronounce phenomenon first try. In conclusion, quack, moooo and phenonemenonmenonnon... Oh Poo. http://s4.invisionfree.com/Ultimate_RP/index.php Try it! Posts: 1487 | Registered: Sunday, February 10 2002 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Friday, May 7 2004 14:02
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From most factually inaccurate to least: quote:The United States, Canada, Mexico, France, Spain, Italy, Russia, China, Japan, South Africa... can anyone name a country that is not either the UK or in a state of civil war that does NOT have a constitution? quote:Read my post again, carefully. Note how incredibly modified and qualified the statements regarding agreement were. I say that your thinking is fundamentally flawed, and you say that there will be issues that need to be worked out. That constitutes agreement on some level, that the system is neither complete nor as good as you want it to be. I am neither "in mistake" nor (the correct word) mistaken. quote:I didn't say that you had to have a document. I said that you had to be careful with your wording. If you really want to be a revolutionary leader some day, you have to make sure that other people know what you're talking about. As a point of fact, no revolutionary leader has ever risen to any level of prominence, much less succeeded, without possessing good verbal skills. Government by "plain ole common sense" is an interesting concept, but your common sense may not be the same as other people's common sense. Look at any truly divisive issue today and you'll see what I mean. quote:I'm saying, and I will say again until you understand/believe me, that I think my objections point to fundamental flaws in the way you're going about designing your system. You may disagree, but you can't correctly say that I'm making an effort to nitpick, because I'm not. Fundamental flaws and superficial flaws are different. If I were pointing out superficial flaws, that would be one thing, and your response would be appropriate. However, I do not believe that I am. Therefore, you should at least have the courtesy to disagree with me but recognize what I am doing. I would accept you saying that you think that you will work out the things that I am bringing up during later phases of planning, but not that I shouldn't be bringing them up. Better to prevent than to patch haphazardly. Moreover, a programmer may not be able to fix typos in a line of code before he writes it, but a programmer can (and should -- every halfway decent programmer does this) make sure that the logic of his code makes sense before he writes it. (To make a BoA reference) You can't have a creature with animated flashing colors using Avernumscript, so there's no point in planning to code for that and take out the bugs later. The call simply doesn't exist. -------------------- Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!! (The home of BoA's HLPM v1.1!) Rate my scenarios! Northern Kingdom 0: Prologue High Level Party Maker Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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Agent
Member # 618
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written Saturday, May 8 2004 08:14
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(How did I know?) Kel.... whatever. I am no fool. I have exceedingly good VERBAL skills. I know exactly what I am doing. It does not need any revolution. I, verbally speaking, have exceedingly good orational skills. I have my plan. I will go through with my plan. This is real life. Not theory nor in potentia. I know the odds. I know the bet. And there is nothing you can say that will swerve me one inch from my path. I cannot convince you with any ease. But I will not be changed. And I will prevail. In the end I shall either be right or wrong. I will either win or crash and burn. This is where my belief is important. This IS my belief. [ Saturday, May 08, 2004 08:17: Message edited by: FatBatMonkey ] -------------------- I like to say quack because I can, I like to say moooo because I can, but I don't like saying ergle flmp because I can never pronounce phenomenon first try. In conclusion, quack, moooo and phenonemenonmenonnon... Oh Poo. http://s4.invisionfree.com/Ultimate_RP/index.php Try it! Posts: 1487 | Registered: Sunday, February 10 2002 08:00 |
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Off With Their Heads
Member # 4045
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written Saturday, May 8 2004 09:25
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FBM: If I was, I'd start referring to America as a "colony". Alec: In case your history fails you, the treaty of Paris was in 1782. FBM: You also have a sentence structuring which... needs help, let alone the grammar. "stand on its own legs absent the mainstream religions", "foster social mores.". Mores: The accepted traditional customs and usages of a particular social group. BtI: FBM, you were wrong about the grammatical point. FBM: what you seem to forget is that the majority of the high-ups in the Republican party are, in fact, Jewish. Donald Rumsfeld for one. Boots: Rumsfeld isn't Jewish. But thanks for playing Find the Jewish Conspiracy! Better luck next week. AM: Why don't you take some time to learn about the government instead of reacting to the media and blaming problems on Jewish people (who's biased here?), and then come back to talk? FBM: Anarchy is merely a lack of government. You over-complicate it, and thereby lose the point. Anarchism: The name given to a principle or theory of life and conduct under which society is conceived without government - harmony in such a society being obtained, not by submission to law, or by obedience to any authority, but by free agreements concluded between the various groups, territorial and professional, freely constituted for the sake of production and consumption, as also for the satisfaction of the infinite variety of needs and aspirations of a civilized being. [This goes on.] BtI: You're a snotty 14 year old with a serious case of arrogant stupidity. FBM: Well quite frankly I'm sure even Alec could come up with something better than most of the societies we have nowdays. Alec: I'd start with getting rid of you. Anyone in the Isles up to a contract hit? The pay isn't so great, but the satisfaction of the job should be more than enough of a motivator. FBM: Devising a new system is not easy. FBM: You sir, are a barbarian. AM: Maybe if you say something substantive instead of flaming everyone, you'll get something out of it. FBM: One last thing, NEVER, EVER say that something is certain or definite or impossible. NEVER use the one or the zero. Alec: You know, it's very convenient to be able to say you were just joking when someone essentially proves that you are the worst sort of idiot. FBM: I lay down the tenets and look... damn semantics frags it. Semantics: The meaning or the interpretation of a word, sentence, or other language form. FBM: I have exceedingly good VERBAL skills. FBM: I cannot think of the correct words. Verbal: Of, relating to, or associated with words Skill: Proficiency, facility, or dexterity that is acquired or developed through training or experience. FBM: Oooooo! Madam! FBM: I deal in practicallities Alorael: I think FBM needs to get off his high horse and fix his own posts before complaining about others' perfectly acceptable use of language. Good verbal skills. Yeah. And lost_king was a good scenario designer. [ Saturday, May 08, 2004 09:27: Message edited by: Kelandon ] -------------------- Kelandon's Pink and Pretty Page!! (The home of BoA's HLPM v1.1!) Rate my scenarios! Northern Kingdom 0: Prologue High Level Party Maker Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00 |
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This Side Towards Enemy
Member # 3098
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written Sunday, May 9 2004 02:51
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Incidentally, I think I know what FBM may have meant when he mentioned Rummy being Jewish. He isn't, but his deputy Paul Wolfowitz is. However, the point he was trying to make was still flawed, because what fires Wolfowitz is not his religion but his insanity. -------------------- "I particularly like the part where he claims not to know what self-aggrandisement means, then demands more wing-wongs up his virgin ass" Posts: 961 | Registered: Thursday, June 12 2003 07:00 |
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Agent
Member # 618
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written Sunday, May 9 2004 10:19
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Hmmm... this is extremely amusing... nice mix'n'match job too... whatever. I was pretty sure it was Rumsfeld, I know that one of his (Bush) real, main advisors is and many other members of the Republican party are... then again it was supposed to be an idle, not-that-serious comment. I suppose it would help if I could be angry against anyone. But I can't and so the immense irony is key. And so is extremely amusing. -------------------- I like to say quack because I can, I like to say moooo because I can, but I don't like saying ergle flmp because I can never pronounce phenomenon first try. In conclusion, quack, moooo and phenonemenonmenonnon... Oh Poo. http://s4.invisionfree.com/Ultimate_RP/index.php Try it! Posts: 1487 | Registered: Sunday, February 10 2002 08:00 |