G4 Beta testing stories (SPOILERS)
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Monday, November 20 2006 13:40
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So the game is out there, and I guess we can talk about it. I have tried a rebel Infiltrator who was built as a traditional glass cannon Agent until Chapter 5, but was still able to finish the game on Normal. Nothing very novel to report there: she snuck up on everything, and played all the tricks that used to work. I think her exploits played some role in motivating the Great Change. Jeff seemed perturbed to learn that she was able to slaughter Poryphra Ruins by exploiting walls and range. Also a Loyalist Lifecrafter, who was nothing remarkable until he hit Camp Gamma and cashed in all his veteran Vlish for a single Wingbolt. That thing rocked; it took down practically anything with one shot, though I had to watch the ammo supply. Killing Monarch was an epic battle, and only barely successful. I think at this stage he was still on Torment. Later he dropped to Normal on instruction, and picked up a Kyshakk to start Chapter 4. He finished Chapter 4 with no trouble at all, picking up a Rotghroth along the way. He pumped Intelligence diligently, and before long had enough essence to put major buffs on his guys. This led to some silliness in the end game. His Rotghroths charged straight through the energy barriers and took out Akhari Blaze and Greta easily, without any help from the Shapers. Finally a rebel Servile, who was mostly about Melee and Blessing but has picked up serious Mental Magic near the end of the game. He has just reached Quessa Uss, mostly without much trouble, but on Torment. There were many good battles, but the most recent one that stands out for me was the Servile's campaign against Monarch. When he finally got to grips with Monarch, it was easy; but getting there was tough, because he had no essence pods. So he needed to reach Grosch Pits without using his buffs, to slay the Warped Creator. That took a lot of scouting and planning and nerve, crossing two tough zones to reach a third one. The Servile was also able to kill all three Barrier Zone shapers, and the Forgotten One. But he could not cope at all well, on Torment, with the above-ground Barrier Zones. -------------------- We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 6785
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written Monday, November 20 2006 14:51
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Running all my games on Torment to the bitter end. I started out testing a Rebel Infiltratot (agent) with high mechanics (12) and leadership (7) up through roughly the demo part. He was starting to have some trouble in combat but it was gettiing fixed. Then Jeff wanted some more testing of Lifecrafters and creations so I stopped.. Also ran a pure pacifist Rebel Servile with a strenth boosted fyora to do all the fighting. Never used a weapon, crystal, or wand which made for a lot of money. I used dazed to stun the monsters and let the fyora fry everything out there. I really wanted to see how far I could go. Ran a Rebel magic shaping Lifecrafter to the end. Had mechanics at 12 to get that Girdle of Genius from the trapped chest so I was always hurting for skill points. I used 2 strength raised artilas through to chapter 3 when I added 2 glaahks. Monarch was a tough fight since I had to stay near to heal my creations. Replaced the artilas with a wingbolt in chapter 4 and had fun. Lost the 2 glaahks in the duel in Quessa-Uss, but the gazer replacement was great. I used them until the end but since I was down to 2 essence pods I missed some areas. Almost destroyed all the Shapers in the "impossible" fight in the Northforge Warrens and found the glitch that partial victory meant you couldn't finish the game. Had some trouble with the expert area killing the southern sentinel so I replaced the wingbolt with a drakon and everything became simple. To prove that It was possible to win even that fight impossible fight with an amoral fire shaping Lifecrafter. I helped the Shapers and turned around and betrayed the to help the Rebels. Running with first 3 fyoras and later 2 more roamers I breezed through. Adding 2 kyshakks in chapter 3 at Camp Gamma and a drayk for the fyoras and one roamer made the remaining game almost a cake walk. At chapter 5 I split into two different games. The Rebel version had 2 drakons for more power and walked through the Poryphra ruins slaughtering everything. The expert area was trivial with my army. Then I went an killed everything in the Northforge Warrens. The Shaper version used 3 cryodrayks instead of the drakons. So I got to kill Rebels instead and didn't need any help from the Shapers for the end. The kyshakks had over 1000 health before augmentation and essence armor at the end. You get to field an army with 22 intelligence for over 800 essence. I'm trying an amoral Servile now and I'm fighting Monarch for the second time to see how to fulfill quests to get access to the most quests for Chapter 4. Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00 |
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Triad Mage
Member # 7
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written Monday, November 20 2006 15:29
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I love the new spells - Spine Shield is definitely underrated and very powerful, and I can't count how many tough battles I've been saved by Augmentation and Regeneration. -------------------- "At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander ==== Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet ==== You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse! Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 6292
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written Monday, November 20 2006 17:46
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I too worked hard to slaughter the entire shaper camp at the Poryphyra Ruins and was able to whittle them all away bit by bit with my Trakovite-inclined Infiltrator who never made any creations until the Titan's Lair. I killed everyone but Miranda, who was impossible to kill as a singleton, especially considering she was accidentally summoning rodhizons instead of rothgroths at the time. Jeff was startled I'd been able to get that far and said he was subsequently beefing them all up, explaining the camp was supposed to be unbeatable. I got the weird experience of later meeting and fighting the same people in the final chapter I had already eliminated. I was also able to kill off the entire Shaper party before they moved on the Drakons in the Shaping Halls. That also was not supposed to be possible to do, so they got beefed up as well. Heck, I didn't know any better. I bump into enemies, and I assume I'm meant to kill them. I could not beat the Southern Sentinel in the Titan's Lair as the solo Infiltrator, despite her massive magical powers. So I bought the ability to make a couple rothgroths and that made it possible. Jeff made the Titan harder to beat, because I found an exploit that enabled me to trap it against a pillar. I always thought, and continue to think, that Shaper Monarch is too easy and anticlimactic to kill for all the trouble it was to get to him. I played about ten different games, four or five of them all the way through. I think you get to do more and get some better gear all in all as a pro-Shaper, but I'd have to test that out further. I was able to hit level 40 with at least a couple of my PC's in doing all possible tasks and being able to disarm all mines. -S- -------------------- A4 Items • A4 Singleton • G4 Items • G4 Forging • G4 Infiltrator • NR Items • The Lonely Celt Posts: 2009 | Registered: Monday, September 12 2005 07:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 6785
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written Monday, November 20 2006 19:11
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Actually you can get to level 42 as a lifecrafter will half a dozen creations if you are willing to do quests for both sides. I found that with an army and being buffed that even the improved impossible fights are doable. My gripe was that the southern sentinel takes a long time to kill unless you have drakons since they have twice the effective damage of other tier 5 creations against drakons. Cryodrayks also do well. Playing off both sides allows you to find the weaknesses of the Shapers before you attack. Going in cold as a Rebel tends to result in many reloads. Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Monday, November 20 2006 22:30
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That southern sentinel, and numerous other bad monsters including the Titan, are a lot easier with judicious use of mental magic. Even one charm tends to put damage on the main boss, and draw multiple attacks away from you. I was able to 'kill' but not kill Miranda in Poryphra Ruins in the Rotdhizon epoch. Actually, like Alwan she just ran away. I think it was on Torment, but maybe only Normal. It's hard to compare such exploits in beta, of course, because different characters rode the waves of beta changes differently. When my earlier characters fought Monarch, he was pretty darn deadly. He used a Reaper baton in melee, for instance. He seems to have been nerfed now. -------------------- We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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Triad Mage
Member # 7
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written Monday, November 20 2006 23:04
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Monarch was a fun long fight as my missile servile on Torment. It was never really in doubt, though. -------------------- "At times discretion should be thrown aside, and with the foolish we should play the fool." - Menander ==== Drakefyre's Demesne - Happy Happy Joy Joy Encyclopedia Ermariana - Trapped in the Closet ==== You can take my Mac when you pry my cold, dead fingers off the mouse! Posts: 9436 | Registered: Wednesday, September 19 2001 07:00 |
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Warrior
Member # 5268
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 00:49
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I still haven't finished it. I got sidelined right after 10.4.8 came out because the game crawled to a halt on my Intel Mac until the universal version came out. That took a good three weeks out of testing. I had finished chapter 3 and had just started chapter 4. Until then my 'agent' had been kicking serious butt (the gruesome charm is great because you can offset its effects with augmentation and still have extra essence into the bargain). Then came 'the change'. I struggled to make it to Quess'Uss after that but as a singleton I just didn't have the staying power because my energy was depleted in 4 or 5 attacks (2-3 turns basically and I thought having 500 energy should be enough for anyone). To get through any meaningful fight I had to pop essence pods like candy and nibble away at everyone with frequent trips back to town. I pretty much gave up because it was so tedious and my character was messed up for the new balance. I started up a lifecrafter and there I stand. Posts: 148 | Registered: Tuesday, December 7 2004 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 6785
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 02:09
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I reran the Monarch fight as a servile and missle attacks are slow but sure way to kill him. I tried melee to speed it up and found that he repeatedly slowed me so the fight was a lot closer than usual. My first lifecrafter barely finished the game because he used almost every essence pod up in chapters 3 and 4. I found the revisions to chapter 5 helpful since I could replay most of 4 and all of 5 and conserve essence pods to slowly let me play more of the game. Mental spells are way more powerful than they used to be. Essence shackles when you can hit can slow even the Titan to barely an attack, Mass madness can switch most of your enemies over to your side and make fighting armies relatively painless. [ Tuesday, November 21, 2006 02:12: Message edited by: Randomizer ] Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 06:02
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Spine Shield is really great. Wrack is a fantastic spell; a few of these really cut tough opponents down to size. I don't have a good feeling for when Dominate fades and Charm cuts in, but both Charm and Mass Madness can be great. So far I haven't found either to be a gamebreaker, though, because I maybe get one or two enemies; they just take the heat off. But since these are all-or-nothing attacks, mileage may vary widely. Essence Shackles is often valuable, but there are limits, because a lot of the tougher enemies re-haste themselves regularly. -------------------- We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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His Mighty Tentacle
Member # 627
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 07:01
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I took a missile shock trooper through the game. Good stuff. Hard hitting. I've taken a warrior through the game too, with both melee and missiles. And the occasional creation. I found battle creations to be invaluable for him, especially plated bugs. 10ap means 2 attacks a round, or attacking one target very far away. Jeff I think was more than a little suprised when I sent him a save file of a true stealth servile. I had progressed quite a ways in to the game. Melee skills were ignored mostly. Leadership and Mech were pretty high. I had some blessing magic and a whole lot of mental magic. Even worse was the trail of bodies I had left behind. I think Jeff was wondering how I had pulled it off. After some beta changes, I recreated my servile, focused on stealth. Blessing magic, mental magic, and the odd bit of sharpshooting with a baton. To give you an idea of how strong this build can wind up being, I was able to clear all three barrier zones above and below. I was also able to slaughter the Polyphora Posse and slew every one of the infiltrators. I was also able to stand my ground and fight during the prison break. Serviles are little monsters. They are dangerous and fun. Different. Not quite an Agent. I think the servile could be my new favourite class. -------------------- If I could make just one wish, I would want a tasty vlish. Geneforge IV. Still no tasty vlish. Posts: 1104 | Registered: Tuesday, February 12 2002 08:00 |
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Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 07:26
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The Servile is the class I have been waiting for since I started running melee agents in G2. More balanced than I was expecting, though. Analysis forthcoming. Anyone care to explain what this 'Great Change' consisted of? -------------------- Slarty vs. Desk • Desk vs. Slarty • Timeline of Ermarian • G4 Strategy Central Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00 |
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Shock Trooper
Member # 4239
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 08:16
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quote:Presumably the move from the old combat style (where you needed 5 AP to attack) to the new one (where you can attack with any number of AP). -------------------- There are two kinds of game players...those who are newbies, and those who were. Posts: 322 | Registered: Monday, April 12 2004 07:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 08:46
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Plus, critically, the rule that you can't move after casting a spell or attacking, even if you are hasted enough to have lots more AP still left. This means hit-and-run tactics, the staple of the old Agent, are history. You pretty much have to stand and fight. (Actually, it's not quite that way. You can move after an attack if you have 5 or more AP left AND are moving in order to click on something. So hasted melee creations can hit non-adjacent targets in the same round.) On the plus side, you can do an awful lot in your round, especially if you have a lot of AP, once you figure out how to get most bang for your AP buck. And melee is a much better option when you don't lose your attack while travelling, though of course this cuts both ways. Shortly before all that, Jeff also prevented you from closing doors in the presence of enemies, so you can't exploit their inability to open them to kill them with impunity. All together, the great change was pretty great. -------------------- We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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Raven v. Writing Desk
Member # 261
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 09:17
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Does this mean that empty pots and boxes are the new doors? "I can't hit-and-run. Oh, wait -- there's an empty pot around that corner! I'd better inspect it, coincidentally getting out of this kyshakk's sight..." -------------------- Slarty vs. Desk • Desk vs. Slarty • Timeline of Ermarian • G4 Strategy Central Posts: 3560 | Registered: Wednesday, November 7 2001 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 6785
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 09:20
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In hasted mode under the new combat system you can attack, use 1 or 2 items at 3AP each and then attack again. So for instance you can daze, attack with a crystal or use a pod/spore, and attack anything that wasn't dazed. The retreating after an attack is still possible if you only use crystals but there aren't as many as in earlier games. The old tactics still work but you need to modify them. Also batons were restored to their former deadliness so it's easy to do over 100 points in damage with moderate dexterity and missle weapons skill. Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 10:27
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There aren't a lot of boxes or corpses stashed conveniently around corners. And even then, enemies can chase you around the corner and still get you. So apart from teasing things out by lobbing icy crystals, you do pretty much have to stand and fight, at least for a round. -------------------- We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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His Mighty Tentacle
Member # 627
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 10:29
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Terror is more important than ever now. -------------------- If I could make just one wish, I would want a tasty vlish. Geneforge IV. Still no tasty vlish. Posts: 1104 | Registered: Tuesday, February 12 2002 08:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 6292
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 16:27
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Vlish, would you elaborate on your Stealth Servile? Namely, how much mental magic are you talking about...more than the 7 or 8 levels needed to get all spells,and if so, how much more. I had moderate success with basic levels of Charm and Mass Madness as an Infiltrator, but not enough to seriously help in battles by affecting the bigger badder boys. Sounds like high levels of Mental Magic could really wreak some havoc though. What do you wind up killing with as a Stealth Servile? Baton? Get them to kill each other? Did you have any creations? -S- -------------------- A4 Items • A4 Singleton • G4 Items • G4 Forging • G4 Infiltrator • NR Items • The Lonely Celt Posts: 2009 | Registered: Monday, September 12 2005 07:00 |
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His Mighty Tentacle
Member # 627
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 16:43
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No creations. I think mental magic was 9 or 10. Blessing magic was, hm, lower, but there are items to boost that. Well, I could have summoned creations. I really didn't bother with it much. He was stealthy, but he had killed a great number of shapers. He may or may not sneak past creations, but he had it in for shapers. I'd scramble their creations brains, make them go rogue, and then run down the shaper like the vengeful little servile I was. Terror kept the masses away from me. I'd walk through an area in combat mode, hasted, and first sign of a monster, terror, daze, dominate, charm, whatever the situation demanded, and then run down and shoot anything that moved. From items alone I had enough battle magic to cast acid shower and the lightning aura spell. And essence orbs too. All from items. Mass Madness when you get it is very nice. I especially liked the fight with the infiltrator in the servile cultist encampment. Every time he summoned something, I'd make it go rogue against him. Soon, he was overwhelmed. To beat the snot out of the infiltrators, you need a submission baton and or a reaper baton if you can get one. Then you need some wrack, shackles, etc, and strong mental magic. Mental magic is the KEY element in this game. More so than battle magic. There are some tough fights. Maintaining control is vital now, no joke. Since monsters can move more than they used to and still tag you, you must shut them down. Terror was probably my most used spell. The ability to daze and then snipe at will with a baton while blessed and hasted will take you to nearly the endgame with no effort at all. -------------------- If I could make just one wish, I would want a tasty vlish. Geneforge IV. Still no tasty vlish. Posts: 1104 | Registered: Tuesday, February 12 2002 08:00 |
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Law Bringer
Member # 6785
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 17:18
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Spine shield is great for attacking golems, glaahks, and rotgroths since they do more damage to themselves then you usually can. Mental spells are the way to go. Get them all. Daze from the start and strong daze if you can get it from the Shapers in Chapter 3. Essence shackles with mental magic at 9 will slow down the Titan to almost a crawl. Mass madness or madness gems for the group fights. In Northforge Warrens I got almost everyone to fight on my side. Even before Jeff made them more effective I used mass madness against the Southern Sentinel to convince his enslaved cryodrayks to come over and fight for me. The madness gem in Valeya Ruins got the Guardian's creations to mostly fight amongst themselves. Most monsters will first attack charmed ones ahead of you. Posts: 4643 | Registered: Friday, February 10 2006 08:00 |
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Shaper
Member # 6292
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 17:18
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Interesting, Vlish. I never used Terror once in all my games. I think I'm used to how boring or unuseful it was to use in A4, and this is the first Geneforge game I've played, so I'm not sure if it was useful before here. Daze and Mass Madness I used quite a bit as certain characters in my beta runs to good effect. As Servile, were you able to beat the Southern Sentinel, the Titan, the Forgotten One, the Eyebeast and creations in the Windswept Farms, the nasty Drakon in the village northwest of Northforge (he drops a very tasty ring?) Anything you WEREN'T able to do or beat? How much endurance, strength, and intelligence did you wind up putting into the Servile? Do you bother with much Spellcraft? -S- [ Tuesday, November 21, 2006 17:20: Message edited by: Servile Synergy ] -------------------- A4 Items • A4 Singleton • G4 Items • G4 Forging • G4 Infiltrator • NR Items • The Lonely Celt Posts: 2009 | Registered: Monday, September 12 2005 07:00 |
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His Mighty Tentacle
Member # 627
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written Tuesday, November 21 2006 17:33
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I did clear the windswept farms. I did not do the optional area with this servile. I don't remember exact stats. Maybe 8 strength at the end, with items. Int was, hrm, 10? Mech and leadership were both at base 10, higher with items. Spellcraft was raised a few times, I think after I bought training. He was a murderous little bastard. And he was made before the revamping of the character classes where the servile started with four strength. Had some melee, higher missile skills, a little bit of quick action and parry, but mostly from items. In my prototype build, Jeff said my combat skills were gruesomely neglected. They looked that way, but with buffing abilities, I'd never miss. -------------------- If I could make just one wish, I would want a tasty vlish. Geneforge IV. Still no tasty vlish. Posts: 1104 | Registered: Tuesday, February 12 2002 08:00 |
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Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
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written Wednesday, November 22 2006 05:19
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I tried Windswept Farms the easy way, squishing the frozen creations first. Last I checked, this was still possible if you slowed them, since then you could kill them before they had time to regenerate. But then with my Infiltrator I decided to fight fair, and I challenged Thora Eye in her (?) lair. This led to multiple waves of attacks by bad creations, which I survived by counter-attacking. That is, I used the long counter along the east wall of Thora's hut as a wall, which allowed only one enemy at a time to reach me. If it was a Battle Beta, it was harmless, and I could just shoot the other things and let it flail away. If a Rotghroth got in there, that was a bit more trouble. But in any case this kept subsequent waves from entering the building until there was a clear route to me, so I could keep a Battle Beta alive there, attacking me futilely, while I rested between waves. -------------------- We're not doing cool. We're doing pretty. Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00 |
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His Mighty Tentacle
Member # 627
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written Wednesday, November 22 2006 05:37
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I did pretty much the same thing, only I used Terror to give me some breathing room when I needed it. -------------------- If I could make just one wish, I would want a tasty vlish. Geneforge IV. Still no tasty vlish. Posts: 1104 | Registered: Tuesday, February 12 2002 08:00 |
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