Need Help with surviving in G3

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AuthorTopic: Need Help with surviving in G3
Member # 6830
Profile #0
So okay, in the previous Geneforge games I went with a shaper. All good and fun. I had a reasonable time of it with my creations, and it wasn't too tricky. I did have the annoying habit of having my shaper getting ambushed in the first round of combat and dying in a single hit though. The constant need to save and reload got me a little annoyed, so this time I decided to go with... a Guardian.

Now, I figured that seeing as its like the warrior class with the least amount of energy that it should be decent as a single stand alone guy. I figured, hey, so I mightn't kill so fast, but with some healing pods I should be able to wade through and survive. Not at all. I'm now up to Dhonals Isle and through the whole time I've had nothing but strife trying to keep my poor guy alive, he dies in about 3-4 hits. I take Alwan around with me and he has similar problems.

I have read Matt P's guide, but my sort of gripe with it is that its rather vague on stat investment 'oh yeah, this is good. Yeeeah, put some points in here too.', and I have tried my best with it but in all honesty, my Guardian sucks terribly. I went with a missile weapons guy since the words "extremely effective" caught my eye. So without further ado, heres my current stats:

Level 15 Guardian
Strength: 6 Dexterity: 8
Intelligence: 2 Endurance: 5

Melee Weapons: 3 Missile Weapons: 9
Quick Action: 6 Parry: 4

Battle Magic: 1 Mental Magic: 1
Blessing Magic: 1 Spellcraft: 1

Fireshaping: 1 Battleshaping: 1
Magic shaping: 0 Healing craft: 3

Leadership: 8 Mechanics: 9
Luck: 2

Currently wearing, Agent Cloak, Fibrous Shield, Acid Baton, Girdle of Strength, Nimble Sandals, Leather Vambraces, Ruby Breastplate, Shielding Band, Miner's Gloves, and Blessed Bauble.

:| where have I gone wrong? what can I improve so I can actually survive? So I can really kill things 'exceptionally well' like supposedly a missile Guardian can?
Posts: 7 | Registered: Friday, February 24 2006 08:00
Nuke and Pave
Member # 24
Profile Homepage #1
The first thing I notice is your lack of creations. While Guardian isn't as strong in shaping as a Shaper, he is still decent at it. Agent is the class for going solo. It seems to me that missile guardian (like archers in most RPGs) needs a couple of tough companions to keep the enemies from reaching him.

Another general observation is that you seem to be missing a lot of side-quests and books/canisters. I don't remember exactly, but it feels to me like you should have higher shaping and magic skills just from books/canisters and quest rewards at this point in the game.

Also, if you completely abandon magic, you have to use pods in most battles, because being blessed, hasted and shielded makes a huge difference.

However, I haven't played Guardian in Gf3 (and he was much easier in Gf2), so I can't give specific advice about stats, items and strategies.

Be careful with a word, as you would with a sword,
For it too has the power to kill.
However well placed word, unlike a well placed sword,
Can also have the power to heal.
Posts: 2649 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00
Member # 6830
Profile #2
I'm trying to be pro-shaper, i thought Canisters were bad if you were? I was avoiding having them for that reason. I used one for healing, and that was it.

Its a matter of points. I just don't have enough to go around- invest in creations huh? with what? I don't have the energy to make more than say, one, and it would likely be quite a weakling. Especially considering how loathe I am being to use any of them canisters.

If theres more quests to improve my stats which don't rely on Canisters, I havn't found them yet.
Posts: 7 | Registered: Friday, February 24 2006 08:00
Nuke and Pave
Member # 24
Profile Homepage #3
No Canisters is a pretty tough variant to play, although it does give you a better ending. You can still get that ending if you use 5 or fewer canisters, but you need to chose your 5 very carefully. Other than that, I can't say much since I prefer to play with Shapers.

As for creations, gaining levels makes a big difference. So even a simple Fyora that you've managed to keep alive from the start of the game would have become a powerful forse by now.

[ Friday, February 24, 2006 13:57: Message edited by: Zeviz ]

Be careful with a word, as you would with a sword,
For it too has the power to kill.
However well placed word, unlike a well placed sword,
Can also have the power to heal.
Posts: 2649 | Registered: Wednesday, October 3 2001 07:00
Member # 6816
Profile Homepage #4
where u went wrong is u got no shaping or magic skills. thought for gaurdian their unimportant u still need em. also u need higher parry. so just get some high healh creatures like thads or batle alphas and use em as a shield. then gut everything with your baton while your creatures get gunned down.

i eat serviles for breakfast.
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Posts: 42 | Registered: Monday, February 20 2006 08:00
His Mighty Tentacle
Member # 627
Profile #5
I am the one that really pushed the Missile Guardian through his paces in G3. On TORMENT.

It works.

I can see a couple of flaws.

In short.

I ignored magic and used items instead.

I pumped my creations. I used every creation boosting item I could afford to use.

I hit hard and faded away. In short, don't wake up to much. Creep forward in combat mode, shoot somebody, and run away, leading them back to your creations, who will mop them up. A pack of Fyoras or Cryoras are wonderful. As are Roamers. You are a huntsman... You must have a strong pack.

Creations that use missile attacks and have strong melee are great. The idea is to burn the enemy down before they reach you. Step back as many steps as you can but still have enough action points to attack, and then unleash hell.

Every spare point must go in to dex or missile skill.

Grab every bit that you can, store every crystal, every little monster bit, and forge them in to items. Make wands of fire, icy crystals, submission wands, terror wands, etc, and use them wisely. Prepare your self for battle. Add some luck so items drop more often. Those little icy crystals start doing 60 or more damage quickly, and keep ramping up. Wands allow you to do just about as much damage as an Agent.

You can safely ignore adding any points to melee. By the end of the game, it will have more than you need.

Endurance isn't worth much. There are other means of boosting your hit points. Strength is good, but you don't need much. Store your excess weapons in caches. You WILL be stockpiling an obcene amount of weapons of mass distruction.

Batons are your bread and butter. While crystals are fine and wonderful, save them for harder battles. When you are just mopping up cannon fodder, any old venom or acid baton will do. When dealing with something a bit more dangerous, break out the submission baton. When dealing with anything that first initiates dialog with you and then tries to kill you, break out the reapers and just keep shooting till nothing moves.

If something gets in to melee range, you are probably doing something wrong. Do not do this. Do nothing wrong. Some times, it honestly can not be avoided. But most of the time, it can. I've said it once, and will say it again, hit hard and fade away. Once you have the enemy wanting to kill you, lead it away from the others and back to your pack. Fight on your own terms.

And I did it with and with out using canisters. In some ways, the canister free Guardian was better. He was mortal. He played through pure tactics and was a joy to play.

The canister crazy one on the other hand... At the end, he could just walk in to a room and start blowing stuff up with no real worry about the consequences. He was like the Terminator.

If I could make just one wish, I would want a tasty vlish.

Geneforge IV. Still no tasty vlish.
Posts: 1104 | Registered: Tuesday, February 12 2002 08:00
Electric Sheep One
Member # 3431
Profile #6
I played a melee Guardian (that is, one with lousy missile skills), without canisters, and without much in the way of creations. He had it very tough on Harmony Isle, and had to use lots of pods and crystals and wands to survive. But I made it to Rahul's castle as quickly as I could, snuck into his bedroom, killed his pets with wands and haste and slamming the door each round, and stole his armor and weapons. The armor made a big difference; from then on I had no major problems with the game. In fact I didn't keep that particular armor all that long -- I believe I went with the Crystalline Shroud as soon as I could. The point was just that Rahul's was the first really good armor I found, and it seemed to tip the balance.

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Posts: 3335 | Registered: Thursday, September 4 2003 07:00
Member # 5991
Profile Homepage #7
where u went wrong is u got no shaping or magic skills. thought for gaurdian their unimportant u still need em. also u need higher parry. so just get some high healh creatures like thads or batle alphas and use em as a shield. then gut everything with your baton while your creatures get gunned down.

Next time you post ,can you please use correct spelling and grammar.

-Now I feel like a hypocrite for never being able to correctly use grammar myself.....-

[ Saturday, February 25, 2006 14:17: Message edited by: The Kraken ]

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Posts: 462 | Registered: Tuesday, June 21 2005 07:00
Shock Trooper
Member # 6754
Profile #8
... or, being able to spell "grammar."

My favorite class to play is the lone Melee Guardian. Where I just make myself tough as hell. Focus on Melee Weapons. Lots of Strength. And lots of Endurance. Ignore Dexterity and Intelligence; you're not worried about the enemy hitting you. The fact is, if you can get next to something, it will be dead by the next turn.

Specifically, you start out with 15 skill points. As a Guardian, I spend them on two levels of Endurance and four of Melee Weapons. This leaves one skill point over and puts you at a measly 30 HP to start, but some healing pods sustain you through the fragile early stages of the game. Use your first level up for more Melee Weapons. Once you get Melee Weapons up to 9, it starts costing 4 skill points, so begin building up Endurance, and throw any extra skill points to Quick Action. The idea is that you can always take out early enemies in one hit.

That's how I like it. If you play for mechanics or diplomacy, you'll have to throw away valuable skill points early on for it.

One of these words is mispelled.
Posts: 284 | Registered: Tuesday, January 31 2006 08:00
Member # 6581
Profile Homepage #9
I had played with a Melee Guardian in all the Geneforges and I think that the Guardians are a good choices, but I used all the canisters trought :P .

Anyway, I think you have to do this: unwear all your equipment, then pimp Parry and Quick Actions, then stop when the skills costs 4 points. Forgot the magic. Absolutely. The only magic that a Guardian need are Healing Craft and Blessing Magic (at least one point for cast War Blessing and Protetion before a strong battle).
Then take a few of Intelligience. Trust me, without a bit of essence and energy you won't go far. Don't spend too much points in Shaping. They can be provided by Necklaces or the Shaper Band, and after creating a creature, they are a little useless. And it's true, you haven't a very good equipment. Student of Trinity it's right. Finally, add +2 at Strengh and Endurance.

Oh well, I didn't have your problem in my game. Alwan was a little weak, it's true, but after improving his sword he was a little better.

My stats, if someone is interested (including the equipment's bonuses):
Level 45 Guardian
Strength: 16 Dexterity: 14
Intelligence: 12 Endurance: 13

Melee Weapons: 13 Missile Weapons: 5
Quick Action: 16 Parry: 19

Battle Magic: 0 Mental Magic: 0
Blessing Magic: 8 Spellcraft: 3

Fireshaping: 7 Battleshaping: 7
Magic shaping: 7 Healing craft: 14

Leadership: 13 Mechanics: 14
Luck: 8

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Posts: 1310 | Registered: Tuesday, December 20 2005 08:00
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SO LOW>>>>>>>

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Posts: 87 | Registered: Sunday, October 24 2004 07:00
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Originally written by felix:

SO LOW>>>>>>>

??? ??????
???? ?????
Posts: 883 | Registered: Wednesday, October 19 2005 07:00
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Originally written by felix:

SO LOW>>>>>>>
Felix. PLEASE stop before we all release the fluffy turtles on you, though judging from your actions I'd say you'd already met them. People do not appreaciate what you're doing (and what you have been doing). Just stop.

- Archmagus Micael

P.S. This has nothing to do with the topic, nor is it entirely spamming. It is helping a fledgeling member of the community. Before others help him, like, with a shotgun.

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Posts: 1370 | Registered: Thursday, June 10 2004 07:00
Off With Their Heads
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I'm pretty sure the person who needed this topic has been helped at this point and is done. Therefore, there was no need to resurrect it, and now that it has been resurrected, we should lay it back to rest.

And, because, after that little demonstration in the wee hours of the morning today PST, it deserves to be said again, Felix, stop.

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Posts: 7968 | Registered: Saturday, February 28 2004 08:00